I'd like to introduce the speaker this morning, Steve Stuckey. He's been a priest at the San Francisco Zen Center for many years and lived at Green Belch for quite a number of years and now he lives in Mill Valley and has a sitting group in his home. So I'd like to welcome Steve Stuckey. Good morning. The introduction reminded me I just received in the mail a 25-year anniversary yearbook from my high school in Kansas. And by my name it said, Occupation, Landscape Designer and Zen Priest. And that's been bothering me for a couple of days because I'm kind of proud of that.

[01:04]

I thought, yeah, I kind of like that. And of course, it's not true. I'm not really sure who designs those landscapes. Yet, no one has been able to tell me what a Zen priest is. I could have said other things. I also have two children. One's 19 and one is 13. And I'm married to Lane Olson.

[02:06]

Some of you may know she occasionally makes an appearance in the known Buddhist world as she's involved in designing the Women in Buddhist Practice conferences that come up occasionally. When I moved from Green Gulch in 1979, it's been a quick ten years now, I was pretty confused, I would say, about how to practice outside of a monastic situation. I had become accustomed to doing the things when the bells rang. I felt it was necessary for me to have the problem of how to practice without that support structure.

[03:15]

And I think that's more like the practice that most everyone here is doing, which is that moment after moment you need to create your practice. You need to create your field of Buddhahood. I want to talk today about the story of Joshu and the monk questioning him, case number two in the Hekigan Roku. And the story goes like this. Joshu addressed the assembly. So he was giving a talk like this, and he said, the ultimate path is without difficulty.

[04:24]

Just avoid picking and choosing. As soon as there are words spoken, this is picking and choosing, this is clarity, This old monk does not abide in clarity. Is anything preserved or not? So then one of his students or dharma companions stood up and said, since you don't abide in clarity, what is it that you preserve?" And Joshu said, I don't know either.

[05:29]

And then the questioner continued, Teacher, he said. Why do you say? Since you don't know either, why do you say? I don't abide in clarity. At that point, Joshu said, your question is sufficient. Please bow and take your seat. So, what's going on here? This business about picking and choosing, of course, comes from the Xin Xin Ming.

[06:37]

Evidently, Joshua was fond of quoting the Xin Xin Ming. The first line of it goes, The great way is not difficult for those who have no preferences. When love and hate are both absent, everything is clear and undisguised. But let the slightest distinction arise, and heaven and earth are set infinitely apart." Maybe I should say a few words about Joshu. Joshu is One of the more frequently quoted Zen teachers from Tang Dynasty China, partly because he lived so long, and partly because his sayings were very brief and pithy.

[07:43]

He became a Buddhist monk when he was a teenager. And then he found Nansen, a Zen master, to study with when he was 18. And he stayed with Nansen for about 40 years, 40 years until Nansen died. Even when he was 18 and he came and applied to be a student with Nansen, He seemed pretty alert. When he came and visited Nansen, he introduced himself and Nansen said, where have you been staying? And he said, I've been staying at Auspicious Image Temple. And Nansen said, did you see the Auspicious Image?

[08:50]

And Joshu said, Oh, excuse me, I've got to go back. Set the scene here. The scene is that Nansen is sick. He's got a cold and he's lying in bed. So Joshu comes in and meets him there. And so then they have this conversation about the auspicious image and Joshu says, no, I didn't see the auspicious image, but I have seen a reclining Buddha. a reclining Tathagata. And then Nansen gets up and looks at Joshu and says, Well, have you been able to find a good teacher? And Joshu says, I have. And Nansen says, Well, who is he? Who is your teacher? And Joshu says,

[09:53]

It's really good to see you up on your feet with such a severe cold." So Joshu made a quick decision. He picked his teacher, just like that. And then he stayed for 40 years. During that time, of course, there's a story of Nansen killing the cat. That was the day that Joshu was off visiting somewhere else, right? I won't tell that one. But then when Nansen died, Joshu stayed at that temple for a couple of years longer, and then announced that he was going on pilgrimage. So he was almost 60, maybe he was 60 years old at this time.

[11:00]

So now I'm going and wherever I go, if I meet even a seven-year-old child who can teach me, I'll be that child's student. If I meet an ancient hundred-year-old master who needs teaching, I'll stay and teach him." To me, this is a wonderful image of flexible practice as you move through your day's activity, always being ready to teach, always being ready to receive teaching. And Joshu did this for about 20 years, finally settling down when he was 80. And stayed pretty much in one place and had students finding him there.

[12:16]

So sometime after he's 80, the story occurs. the story about the great way is not difficult, just avoid picking and choosing. And then he said, I don't even abide in clarity. So we have this problem all the time of how to choose. I saw an article in the Chronicle this week about how choice is a problem for our culture. We have so many choices. The fact that there are so many choices can be stressful in itself. And not only do we have choices, there's quite a bit of propaganda out there

[13:24]

pulling us to choose this or that. It's impossible to avoid. So how can we make choices without making the distinctions that divide the world that set heaven and earth apart, that divide us from ourselves, how do you make a choice that divides you from your own true nature? How do you make a choice that frees you from that separation between you and your true nature? I think most of us are unprepared to suffer well.

[14:41]

And the teaching of Buddhism is that it's possible to suffer so well that you're free from suffering. By suffering well, I mean that you don't go out asking for trouble, but that when you make a choice, when you make an action, we call that karma, there are consequences embedded in that. And what follows from that is your suffering, your life, You should know that when you make the choice, the suffering comes along with it. Whether you choose something you think is going to be pleasant, or whether you choose something you think is going to be unpleasant, or whether it's even a habitual, kind of half-conscious choice, you should know that the

[16:01]

consequences follow, that they're actually embedded right there in that moment. So there's really no difference then between the original choice and the experience. In other words, for suffering completely, is just knowing your experience or just experiencing your experience completely without trying to move away from it, without wishing it was different. Now we set aside some time to sit.

[17:16]

And when you're sitting, you may find yourself experiencing what you experience directly. But you may also find yourself trying to get away. And then you have to bring yourself back. Those of us who've been doing this for a few years know that it's pretty hard just to sit and keep making that effort to be face-to-face with our experience. We need to make this effort And sitting, now we need to make this effort while we're moving around doing whatever we're doing.

[18:24]

Driving a car. Washing the dishes. Waking up in the middle of the night. I woke up in the middle of the night and I wrote something down. This was this morning. Awakening in the hush of early morning, bladder full. Must be 3 a.m. Rolling out from under the warm dina, not disturbing the sleeping companion. Warm foot finds cool, smooth floor. and takes the weight of the body. How wonderful it is. Breath naturally fills belly and raises the ribs.

[19:27]

Walking slowly through the dark room, distant sound of tires on pavement, footfalls on warm carpet, footfalls on cold wood. I enjoy such experiences all the time, a lot of the time, and occasionally I write something down. Now there was a quote from Dogen, these are my lecture notes. There was a quote from Dogen that I didn't memorize. So Dogen is talking in this case about this practice of not abiding in picking and choosing and also not abiding in clarity.

[20:43]

He says, what is it like to be unstained? To be unstained does not mean that you try forcefully to exclude intention or discrimination or that you establish a state of non-intention, being unstained cannot be intended for discriminated at all. So you might think unstained is some state that is far removed from your present circumstances. But by unstained he means not defiled, not defiled or not colored by ideas that separate.

[21:45]

So actually he means your present circumstances. In our everyday language we talk about choice becomes a political issue or pro-choice. We assume that in this country, in this political system, that people are pretty much independent and able to make their own decisions and live their own lives. And there's some truth to that. The other side of it is that we're all connected.

[22:50]

The other side of it is that not only are we all connected as humans, but we're all connected with the earth itself and with all life forms. For example, we depend on the trees. We depend on the plants. I read recently that human beings consume 40% of the total energy of photosynthesis on the planet, of all the plants on the planet. That's the current situation. But right now we're burning up 40% of all the energy that's

[23:59]

being collected by plants. Either we eat it or we burn fuel. It's an astonishing figure. And we do this, we're completely dependent for our energy on plants, and we do this largely without being conscious of that. So our first practice in that regard is to extend our awareness to that. Include this relationship that we have with the earth and with plants. Notice how our actions contribute. Sometimes I talk about Small things like apple cores.

[25:03]

When you eat an apple, what do you do with the apple core? Some people eat the apple core. Some people throw it away. But where is away? You know, there's no other place. You can't throw anything away. Our effort in practice is to find an appropriate way of taking care of whatever we're in contact with. Taking care of ourselves, our own body. Just sitting up straight and allowing your breath to be complete is an act of taking care of your own body. Find yourself with an apple core. Find a place to put the apple core, where the apple core can be happiest, where the apple core can do its best.

[26:05]

This is bodhisattva activity, mundane, celestial, whatever, it's bodhisattva activity, taking care of all beings. How you save an apple core is putting it in its best place. We say bodhisattvas, wisdom beings, are those that mature other beings. Well, how do you help an apple core mature? Well, put it in the compost. Maturity in Buddhism is not an end. Maturity is continuing the turning. So the apple core becomes compost, becomes earth. Just as we ourselves do. Just as our bodies do.

[27:10]

So, Joshu is talking about not abiding in some separated place. He's saying that his teaching is not clarity, not enlightenment. His teaching is not practice of picking and choosing. His teaching goes beyond That kind of divided thinking. I used to think that when he asked the monk to sit down, take his bow and sit down, that that was kind of a cop-out. That Joshu was just, I don't know, tired of the conversation, or he had been kind of put in a corner and he was pulling rank, right? He's saying, okay, look, I'm holding the gavel here, so order in the court, you sit down.

[28:29]

But what about the question? If you say, you went to all this trouble to say that you don't abide in clarity, so why did you do that? He's really asking Joshua, why is he teaching? What's the meaning of all this effort, 80 years of practice? And rather than falling into the trap or limited approach of giving some explanation, just giving him some answer. Joshu says, the question, asking the question is sufficient. So he didn't say you shouldn't ask the question. He didn't say, don't bother me with the question, sit down.

[29:35]

He said, asking the question is sufficient. Asking the question is the key to this way, the Zen way. Moment after moment, ask. When you make a choice and you say, this is it, this is what I choose, know that at the same time, that's a question. You don't know what's going to happen next. The little kitten scratches at the door, scratches and scratches, and it kind of waits.

[30:46]

Is somebody going to open the door? Sometimes somebody opens the door. Sometimes the little kitten scratches and turns around and goes and finds a comfortable place to fall asleep. The little kitten doesn't know. Scratching the door is asking a question. We might, from our point of view, say, oh yeah, that's asking a question. But we don't usually think that the little kitten falling asleep is also asking a question. So whatever situation you find yourself in, it's an opportunity. What is it? Who's doing it? When you see yourself getting caught, what is this?

[31:47]

Caught? Yeah. I have this gesture, it's like grabbing onto something, but you can lighten it up a little bit, right? When you're grabbing onto something, feel it. Okay? It's a little bit of lightness. That's the effort of practice. So you can take it, you can let it go. Very hard to do with big relationships. When I walked in today, I saw Alan Marlowe's name. Alan Marlowe, an old friend of mine, I didn't know that he had died. When Marpa, who was Milarepa's teacher, lost his child to death, Marpa cried.

[33:04]

Milarepa asked, actually I'm not sure it was Milarepa or one of his other students, asked, you teach that everything is an illusion, so why are you crying? Neil Rapey said, having a son or daughter is the greatest illusion. Maybe I've talked enough. Are there any questions or comments? Everything matters. Can you say a little more?

[34:22]

Sure. There are a couple of levels of mattering. One is what's in your mind. What are you thinking? It's a sad state to be in if you think that the apple core can be thrown away and it no longer is of interest to you. It's sad because it makes you so small. You actually diminish yourself. Of course, you can't diminish yourself, really. You're really connected with that alpha core. Even if we send it to the moon, we're still connected.

[35:29]

Practically speaking, the apple core is existing in a complex relationship and it's wonderful to, I think, most wonderful to continue the complex relationship. If we oversimplify in that sense in which we reduce things to saying, that which matters is only what I happen to care about, or what I can actually see the pain or the pleasure in. That's reducing the whole universe to a very simple point of view. And naturally much is destroyed in the process. It's actually a very violent act. The implications of it are quite violent, quite destructive.

[36:38]

So, cultivating the way is taking care of each thing. Reiki, we say, it's Buddha, meaning it's truth and it's part of me. Each thing, apple core, teacup, the sound of the bell, brushing the teeth. So not only does it matter, but that's our whole realm of creativity, is being able to see what it is and find how we can help. We can't help the apple core rot after we put it in the compost, really. It'll take care of itself from that point on. But once we've taken it up, taken up the apple, please know that what you do with it makes a difference.

[37:45]

Yeah. Sounds really good. and I think about this 20 or 30 times a day, I wonder if I would get through the day, if I would be able to get through the day, if I really did what you're talking about. I mean, would you flush the toilet? Would you, you know, I mean, what about a piece of paper you throw away, and where does it come from, and where is it going? I just really wonder, I'm afraid to really examine whether I mean I can decide a scope okay well within this I'm going to examine everything and I can try maybe to get it bigger and bigger gradually but you know to think tomorrow morning I'm going to get up and I'm going to take care of every single thing from then on I would really wonder what would happen if I would be able to get through the day let alone not even bringing up a homeless person that you're walking by or anything like that right

[38:58]

But it's like one moral crisis after another, in a way. Right. Yeah, I think that's a very real problem. And because it's so awesome, we tend to give up on the whole thing. or give up on big chunks of it. And it's just like saying, well, since I can't be aware of every breath, I'll just give it up. It's hopeless. It's too much to do to completely change every habit that you have and every thought pattern that you have.

[40:00]

Using your example, starting now or when you get up tomorrow morning or right now. But what we do is do what we can do. Say, do your best. That means that sometimes, sometimes you're not even aware of the opportunity You have to accept that. Sometimes you're aware of the opportunity and you know there's a question here or something unresolved or maybe you could do it a little, maybe you could do something a little more creative than you've been doing. Maybe you need more information. Well, you have to weigh that against everything else that you're doing. You know, well, at this point I can't stop and take care of that because I already am doing this. As I was driving here today from Mill Valley, coming past Larkspur Landing, there was a piece of, it was actually a broken T-stake for fencing, about six feet long, lying in the road.

[41:10]

And one of the things I tell people when they're driving is, take care of the road. How do you take care of the road? Well, sometimes I stop and I, when there's an obstruction, I go and I move it out of the road. But today, it's raining and there's There's cars in front of me and cars behind me, and there's really no room to pull over, so I just kind of swerved around it and kept driving. But sometimes I stop and move the thing out of the road. Sometimes you might stop and take care of an animal that's been hit by the side of the road. It doesn't mean you have to do it every time. If we have four billion people on the planet, you can't cover for everybody. But if we suggest to each other and help each other and encourage each other to make some effort, we must do that.

[42:19]

We can't eliminate all the past karma that creates our situation in one decision to change everything. We have to live it out. We may not be able to turn it around in the sense of saving a planet that we can live in for the next hundred years. I have a sign over my altar that says, is it too late to save the planet? My son, 19, came in and saw that and said, how can you ask that question? How can you say that? How can you even think that? That it could be too late. Well, for me, that's just helpful to remind me that I need to make some effort without knowing the end result. There's no way we can know the end result of our action. But we do know that because we're all interconnected, sometimes even a small action can have great consequences as it plays out down the way.

[43:33]

So don't think that you can just because you're only putting one apple core in the compost one time rather than throwing it in the landfill or the And with the plastics, but that's futile. There's really no way to assess that. So, we human beings are in a bit of a predicament. And we still need to encourage each other to do our best. And sometimes it's discouraging because we know we're not doing enough, or we know we blew it the last seven out of ten times. That's the biggest problem for a Zen student, is keeping the fresh state of mind, right?

[44:42]

This time is this time. Now, one more thing about that. Practically speaking, it may be useful to take a time, like a practice period, like a sasheen, or like what Thich Nhat Hanh calls a day of mindfulness and say, okay, on this day or for the next two hours or for the next two minutes, whatever the time frame is, in that period of time, I'm going to be absolutely conscious and do everything completely. And I'm not going to let anything else that's happening deter me from this practice in that time. And doing that occasionally, you discover. You make a discovery that then you can begin to change the rest of your life with.

[45:44]

You may decide, oh, here's something. Now I understand that when I eat a hamburger from McDonald's and it comes from the rainforest and all that, you take the time to think about all that and you may make a decision about eating one less hamburger a week or something. All these things make a difference. You may make a decision about how, when you look at your child,

[46:12]

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