I just returned recently from Tassajara, the practice period there, where we've been studying the Platform Sutra of the Sixth Ancestor Huineng, or Japanese Daikan Ino. And the main thrust of this sutra is, as he says, to discover our essence of mind, and not to stray from our essence of mind once we've discovered our essence of mind. And in order to discover our essence of mind, we should get rid of greed, ill will and delusion, and get rid of, I say get rid of, but do not form attachments to opinions and to objects.

[01:41]

When we can practice in this way, then our essence of mind naturally shines forth, because it's not something that isn't already there. So, it says to discover, which means to uncover, take off the cover. When we take off the coverings, then we can look at the soup. But we can't eat the soup until we take off the cover of the pot. So this is his message, basically, and he says it in various ways. And to get rid of greed, ill will, and delusion, and attachment to objects and to opinions is a kind of poverty.

[02:50]

We're letting go of the stuff that sustains us, that we feel sustains us, and allow our true nature to sustain us, which it does already, but we don't give it an opportunity Even though it's there, we don't realize it. We don't realize what it is, because it's non-graspable. It has no special shape or form, and no special mark. So, as we grow up, we form dependencies. And because we lose faith in our true nature, we look to other sources for sustenance.

[04:12]

So spiritual poverty is letting go of various sources of sustenance in order to depend on true nature, Buddha nature, or as he calls it, essence of mind. And practice is not to stray from essence of mind. But Human beings are all dependent beings. And so I want to, this is a kind of introduction to this koan in the Mumangkong called, Ching Shui is Solitary and Destitute. And he doesn't have an introduction in the Mumang Khan, so Master Mumang just starts out with a story.

[05:19]

And a monk said to Cao Shang, I am Ching Shui, solitary and destitute. Please give me something. Alms, or I'm holding out my bowl. What can you put in it? And Cao Shan said, venerable Shui. And Shui said, yes, sir. Yes, master. Yes, teacher. Something like that. And Cao Shan said, you have already drunk three cups of the finest wine in China. And still you say that you haven't moistened your lips. What's the matter with you? And Mo Man has a comment and he says, Ching Shui is submissive in manner.

[06:27]

Man is very submissive. But what is his real intention? Cao Shan has the eye and thoroughly discerns what Ching Shui means. Tell me, where and how has Ching Shui drunk the wine? That's the koan. And then Mu Man has a verse. With the poverty of Fan Tang and the spirit of Xiang Yu, though he can hardly sustain himself, he dares to compete with the other for wealth. I think we need to define the word poverty, which destitute is one of its characteristics.

[07:29]

Destitute means unable to find something, the inability to find anything. And poverty, of course, means poor, and it implies aloneness. It implies isolation. So there are various levels of poverty and sometimes we can use the term poverty to mean destitute or to mean without something, which is not so good. And sometimes we can use the word poverty to mean without something, and that's good. So good and bad are interchangeable in some way in this regard.

[08:37]

Because poverty is a state of mind. And wealth is a state of mind. But what we usually associate with poverty is actually spiritual poverty. And material poverty is a symptom of spiritual poverty. We may not all agree on this, and there are cases, of course, where there is just complete material poverty.

[09:43]

But if you look deeply and examine, one knows in that area, The cause is usually spiritual poverty. In places like Somalia or Bosnia, what's the cause? Spiritual poverty. people not caring about people. Real poverty of spirit. So, one person can be on the street who has confidence

[10:53]

and nothing. And another person can be on the street without confidence and is destitute and painful and dependent. I'm not making a judgment about people on the street. Everyone needs help. But For a person like Seizei or Sozon, their life is a life of poverty. Voluntary poverty, which is called wealth. To them, this is wealth. There are many people who have all kinds of wealth, but are living in destitute poverty. So, who is actually in poverty and who actually has wealth?

[12:02]

It's a big question. So these, both Sozang and, I say say it's a Japanese name, Ching Shui. So, Cao Shan and Ching Shui. are both monks and their life is a life of not just poverty but realization beyond poverty that there is actually nothing to rely on. So when Ching Shui asks his question, he says, I am solitary and destitute. Solitary It means two different things. One, it means completely isolated. But it also, on the other hand, means completely at one with things.

[13:09]

The whole universe is solitary. And yet, each one of us feels alone and solitary. But the alone and solitary of one person and the alone and solitary of another are two completely different things. Sahasran is alone and solitary with the whole universe, at one piece with the whole universe. So, this is his poverty and also his great riches.

[14:22]

By letting go of everything he finds wealth, great wealth. So Songshan, I mean, Qingshui says, I'm solitary and destitute. In a way, he's kind of bragging. He could be kind of boasting, but he also could be kind of naive in saying, not really understanding his position. He's saying, I really discovered essence of mind. I've gone beyond all opinions, let go of, dropped body and mind. I'm attached to nothing and own nothing. What should I do now? Where am I? So he's kind of asking Sozon for not approval,

[15:32]

What do you think, teacher? And then Zao Shan says, Venerable Shui, he just brings it right down to the moment. He's not going to give him some explanation. He's just going to bring him right to the moment. He said, Venerable Shui. And Shui says, yes, sir. And right there. He drops body and mind. He lets go of everything and just says, yes sir. He's open, without any opinions, expectations, nothing. Here am I. It's like in the Bible, when God speaks to Adam, And Adam says, here am I. There I am.

[16:38]

That's Adam's enlightenment. So Zhaozhan said, you have already drunk three cups of the best wine in China. And still you haven't moistened your lips. What are you complaining about? What are you trying to tell me? So ching shui is submissive in manner. Manner is kind of submissive, but it's questioning. But what is his real intention? What does he really want from Sozang? Saosheng. And Saosheng can see right through him. And he says, tell me, this is Mumu, how has How has he drunk this wine?

[17:45]

What is drinking the wine? And how has he done that? Mubad says, with the poverty of Fan Tang. Fan Tang is a story about this official who was in China, in the Tang Dynasty, he was just on the verge of becoming a high official in the government. But somehow he was forced to go into the street. So instead of taking this high position in the government where he'd be very wealthy, he had to go into the street and he had a family and he pushed his family around in a cart. This is the story. And he had nothing. They had nothing. For ten years they were paupers. And they wore old clothes and just ate what they could find.

[18:52]

And this story is illustrative of someone who went from riches to rags, but without complaint. When he was in the government, that was fine. When he was pushing the cart around, That was okay too. He had nothing. And he just lived from hand to mouth. Without discriminating. And this is illustrative of spiritual poverty. No problem. Either way. It's interesting. analogy, actually, and the spirit of Shang Yu. Shang Yu was a general, and when he was faced with defeat, he was up all night with his mistress and having a good time, not seeming to

[20:08]

care what was happening to him. And this is also sometimes considered a non-attachment to the situation. There's a poem by him that's very famous. It's apparently been sung through the ages. Strength to drive through a mountain, spirit to cover the whole earth, but the time is unfavorable. Xu doesn't want to go forth. You, oh you, what will be your fate? You is his mistress. You, he's worried about her. What will happen to you? Leaving you. And then Mu Man's poem, he says, though he can hardly sustain himself, this is, he's talking about Ching Shui, Though he can hardly sustain himself, he dares to compete with the other for wealth.

[21:11]

That's a kind of, not a joke, but, you know, here's this guy with nothing, absolutely nothing, not even any spirit, no place to even stand. And here he is competing with Sozon for wealth. And So what should Ching Shui do? Now that he's gotten this far, what should he do? Ching Shui has let go of everything. He's dropped body and mind. He's realized essence of mind. He doesn't have anything to stand on, either materially or spiritually. And yet he has great faith.

[22:17]

Maybe he should get a car and a house and marry somebody and have some children. You know? It would be a good idea. live like everyone else, with no attachments to opinions, no attachment to objects, in the midst of objects, no greed, no ill will and no delusion. I think that's what he should do. He should come back into the world and just be as he is. And without making a fuss and just taking on what he has to take on.

[23:33]

And without trying to do something save all sentient beings. It's one thing to have non-attachment when you don't have anything. It's easy to sit zazen in the mountains when there are no disturbances. I just came from the mountains where there are no disturbances. When I go to the mountains to practice, I can easily understand what I'm reading and what I'm studying. Nothing to disturb the mind. It's real spiritual poverty.

[24:40]

You don't have to ask for anything. You don't have to make a living. You don't have to compete. And yet, that's one side of poverty. There's no radios, no toys, no toys. But that's one side of poverty. The other side of poverty is to take up all the toys, to take up the mechanics of life in the world. And to have money, to have things, and yet to not have anything at the same time.

[25:49]

To have a bank account. Nyogen Sensaki, in his commentary to this go on, says monks should, a monk is not a monk if he has a bank account and a car and a wife and blah blah blah, you know. That's true. And yet, there's something missing there. If you think that a monk shouldn't have a bank account, then maybe the monk should get a bank account. What's it like to have a bank account and not be attached to money? What's it like to have thousands of dollars and not be attached to money? Or to have a nice car and not be attached to a nice car?

[26:56]

or to have a house that had no attachment to objects and to be completely free. To be completely free of money, to be completely free of objects, houses, cars, families. This is the real test of spiritual poverty. So the easy part of spiritual poverty is to let go of everything and go up to the mountains. And it's wonderful. But that's one side. And the other side of a monk's life should be to enter into the world. And in the midst of all this stuff, to take it up

[27:58]

without any attachment. Free to let it come or go. If something comes, okay, thank you. If something goes, okay, thank you. To turn with the world, but not to get caught by anything that comes your way. This is to not have anything in the midst of having everything. Each one of us has nothing anyway. Suzuki Roshi used to say, or once said, These are my glasses.

[29:00]

I call them my glasses, but they really don't belong to me, and thank you for letting me wear them. So, what's most important is our attitude, our attitude toward our surroundings, our attitude toward our possessions, material things, the furniture of life, actually. So, that's the most difficult part. So, in our American Sangha, most priests are married, And I have a car and a wife or a child or something. And people say, well, that's not a priest's life.

[30:08]

Maybe so, but in America, that's a priest's life. To spend time in the monastery is good. We should spend time in the monastery, letting go of everything. And then we should come back taking care of things in the midst of the poverty of riches. We have such a wealthy life. It's impossible to avoid it. And yet some people have nothing. and have great suffering. So how do we help people who have nothing and have great suffering? Is this suffering because they have nothing?

[31:12]

Or is it the suffering because they don't understand their own spiritual, or we don't understand how to connect people spiritually with themselves? that our own spiritual life doesn't support them. So, sometimes when I see a neighborhood that's all run down, run down here. And yet, these are the most beautiful houses in town. Once were the most beautiful houses in town, which are now, you know, slum. If people felt that the confidence, if people had the confidence in themselves to rise up where they are, they can turn a neighborhood into a wonderful palace because it's all there.

[32:53]

Potentially all there. And yet people come in, developers, and tear down all that quality space and put up something even shabby for people to move into because it matches the shabbiness of the quality of people's spiritual life. And quality of life just keeps going down and down. Quality of building, furniture, houses, dwellings, workplace, just keeps dropping because spiritual life keeps dropping. When people find their own essence of mind,

[34:01]

create a spiritual life that has confidence, then they bring up their surroundings to match that. So, how can we help to make that happen? I don't know. I think if we help people to have confidence in their true nature instead of depending so much on material things. And material things will match our spiritual life. Any culture that's had a rich spiritual life always has wonderful material things. And and people feel happy.

[35:09]

So I think old Seizei needs to come out. I mean, that's his Japanese name. Seizei needs to come out, do something in the world with his, share that spiritual life with people so that he can find your own. Otherwise, it's just patchwork. We can help people in poverty forever. And that's good. Good thing to do. We have to connect the place with reality, true essence of mind. before anything real and substantial will happen.

[36:19]

Three cups of wine is there for all of us. How do we get people to drink it? You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink. Do you have a question? Grabbing that attitude is the most important. And that finding the essence of mind and staying there is the most important. Still, the form of the activity, the manifestation, also seems important. And if this monk is living in a society where they're very rich, very poor, where people are sleeping on the streets, where there's violence, is the most direct way to saving all beings for him to buy a house and buy a car and have children?

[37:41]

No. But it's a metaphor for entering the world. But we have to enter, it seems to me that when we are entering the world, we also have to pay attention to the particular situation of our world. Yes, that's right. So, paying attention to the particular circumstances. So, don't be attached to the words. Never be attached to the words. If you can see, the meaning behind the words, then that's correct. So, for someone, it may not be appropriate. There may be someone who has had all those things all their life, and then they enter the world with nothing, and that's very helpful.

[38:42]

So, it could be the other way around. Anyway, it's just an example, right? I was just recalling your New Year's Day, your first of the year lecture about 20th century Zambian activists. Yeah. Whatever that means. I don't know what it means. But I think we have to keep finding the meaning over and over again. And you have to find the meaning every day. And today's meaning may not be the same as yesterday's meaning. Just a particular question about the three cups of wine.

[39:44]

Besides meaning, in general, you have this fulfillment. You've drunk this wine. Is there a reference to the three cups? Do you mean perhaps he studied with three teachers? Well, there's a kind of long string of associations which comes out to maybe a double entendre in the kind of wine that was made in China by the famous family. It comes out meaning... I think I wrote it down. Oh yeah, I think it's the character Pi, P-A-I, which means form and color.

[41:12]

Form and color means, it means both form and color, and form and color is a term that means existence, you know, or the phenomenal world, the world of form and color. Suzuki Roshi used to use that term a lot. It's a form and color, but actually comes behind that is this character, which means form and color. And so it comes out to be he's in the realm, he discovered the realm of no form, no color. Like the great death, right? And then it came back to life, in a true sense. Reborn Buddhists. I'm afraid that's what it is. I thought it was really interesting, your discussing

[42:21]

But also, and the essence and the attitude that, you know, but I've done some work with homeless people and I must say that some of them, what hurts the most for some people is the rejection and I think the feeling of contempt they feel from other people. That's right. Spiritual attitude is extremely important and sadly lacking. Yeah, that's right. Sadly lacking. Well, you know, it really comes down to what we call standard of living, you know. is an interesting phrase.

[43:25]

We talk about having a high standard of living. And high standard of living means having all the material objects that we can and being wealthy materially. But that's not a high standard of living, actually. A high standard of living is to be able to live with a high spiritual life, using everything, using the things we have in a way that is harmonious with our life. If you have too many things, you can't deal with them. It becomes gluttony. We have a glut of stuff. Look at all the cars down there. Did it get squashed? I mean, you go to Richmond and you pass all these yards and yards of junk piled high.

[44:33]

You can't have a table without, in a day, ten things collecting on it. The hardest part of life is being able to push your way through stuff and find a place for it. I need a bigger house because I don't have all the room to put all the stuff. So standard of living, what does that mean? That's another paradox. It's a good comment. What is the high standard of living? Truly high standard of living. Well, your talk has brought to my attention, my attachment to the things in my life and how they have me, I don't have them. And that the definition of wealth is, or a high standard of living is, how many resources of the world can we waste?

[45:39]

How much of that can we waste? And it's interesting when I start to think about redefining a high standard of living as everyone in the world having basic human needs met, that somehow I can, my attachment to having my stuff, you know, this is my pile. I really relate to Rumpelstiltskin very well. And, you know, I'm sitting on my pile of stuff and you can't have it. It's an experience of scarcity and insufficiency and a real sense of that insecurity. Yeah. And, yeah, the lack of trust that there is a You know, when you have a sangha, when you live in a community, people take care of each other. But that doesn't exist in a world where there's extreme discrepancies of people sitting on their stuff and keeping it a plain keep-away. Because they're insecure, unfortunately.

[46:40]

You've been talking about our relationship with material things. Yeah, well, I did that not long ago. Meaning of non-attachment with people, right? In short, non-attachment is not the same as detachment. Detachment, you know, means separated. But attachment means that you have attachment to your friend, your spouse, your children, your colleagues, whatever. But within attachment, you have freedom, which is non-attachment. So, yes, we have it, we are attached, we are engaged.

[47:42]

So, my term for non-attachment is correct relationship, appropriate relationship. What is appropriate relationship? It means to be engaged and at the same time to be independent. So, and two people, you know, who come together, lovers or whatever, you know, in order to have a healthy relationship, it's not just symbiotic. Each one has to be independent. And then you give the other person their independence. They give you your independence, and therefore you can have a dependent relationship. You can be dependent without being caught by each other.

[48:50]

Because you're always giving. And so there's the side of wanting and the side of giving. So the side of giving has to be proportional to the side of wanting. But mostly giving. So what we get caught by, as you just said, is our wanting. So whatever it is that we want, we're caught by. We become attached to what we want. So that's why Buddha says desire is the cause of suffering. We get caught by what we want. We get caught by our desire. And then you say, you're punishing me. You're doing this to me. You're doing that to me. But actually, we're doing it to ourself. We're putting ourself in a position through our desire to be punished in some way. Very complex.

[49:56]

And we all get caught, you know, because we all have desire. So what is appropriate desire? What is appropriate relationship, given the desire we have? Very tricky. How do you keep, you know, stay with it, and at the same time, stay, keep, have your freedom? without escaping. Because escaping isn't freedom either, even though it may look like it. How do you stay free in the situation that you're in right now, moment to moment? That's not straying from the essence of mind. So did the teacher then be the mirror of your mind?

[51:08]

Everything is the mirror of your life, and everything is your teacher. But you have a teacher who helps you to see this. I was puzzled at first when he asked if he was so advanced. So what now? He should know. Right, me too. He should know. How come he didn't know? What's the matter with you? So, you know, Mumon says, what is his real intention? Right? So he brings that up as a question. It's a good question. No, then I got the feeling that the teacher's job was to bring it to himself. And then the teacher started to disappear from me as I started to ponder that a little more.

[52:13]

It's a word about the teacher, what the teacher was supposed to do in a relationship, and so on. And that's why I said it felt like the teacher was in the mirror. Well, see, yes. So that's right. So Ching Shree is challenging him to a little repartee. That's what it is. I don't think he really understands. He's not asking for that kind of response. He's saying he wants to get into something with him. And he's testing the teacher, actually. And the teacher gives him a good response. Inspired.

[53:25]

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