Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare I don't know if you'll be able to hear me. You can't. It's pretty noisy. So Blanche Shumpo, Zenkei-san,

[01:02]

asked me to talk about Suzuki Roshi and handed me this book. I haven't said anything yet. Suzuki Roshi's lectures which I edited for our newsletter in Berkeley and after looking over this I read through it last night and I realized how much more editing it all needs. When I did this, some of the fascicles that are in here, some of the most difficult fascicles are lectures to translate, to edit. And in many places, they need to be translated not from Japanese, but just from the way Suzuki Roshi spoke.

[02:15]

And if you read, when you read it now, it's fairly smooth, maybe a little bit bumpy here and there, but it's fairly smooth and you can tell what he's talking about. But these lectures, a lot of them were a particular challenge because there were places where he just wanted to cut that part out and throw it away. But I was determined to untangle the knot of his language and make it read according to the way he meant it to be, I felt that he meant it to be expressed. So I had that much, mostly that in mind when I was editing these talks. And so there are a lot of smaller problems that didn't seem like problems to me. But now when I read it I see there are other problems which are not so big, but the biggest problem I think is the problem of style.

[03:23]

When translating Dogen, which I've done a lot with Tanahashi-san, I try to stick as much as close to Dogen's style and language as possible, and not just kind of freely interpret. But sometimes you have to freely interpret, but you try to stay as close to the style as possible. And so when I ended Suzuki Roshi's lectures, I try to stay as close to his style as possible. And sometimes it comes out in very strange-sounding English. Michael Wenger and I edited Suzuki Roshi's Sandokai lectures for a publication. And when we submitted it to people, most people thought that it was too Japanese, because we wanted to stay with Suzuki-Oshi's style.

[04:43]

So we edited it about 10 times, thinking that we had really refined it a lot. And people still think it was too Japanese. Maybe, I don't know. But there is a way of editing, which is just take it all out and interpret. Do a lot of interpreting. So I haven't done that so much, but I think that there's that step which needs to happen. And in these talks, I can see that they would read more smoothly if there was just a little more interpretation and less literal and being less sticking too close to Suzuki Roshi's own language. So they really needed to be cleaned up a lot. I know you can't hear me in the back row very well, so you can always come up closer.

[05:45]

We've arranged the room so that we're closer to the creek. So, as I have been reading through this collection that you're studying, I find myself re-editing it, which is very good. So, today I thought that I would talk about the last lecture. There are 12 lectures, and this is the last one.

[07:33]

So this is a lecture that has many different parts to it. It's pretty long. And the first part, he talks about transcending the attachment to either Tassajara practice or city center practice. And in the second, section, he talks about to be and should be, which I find very interesting. I'll talk about that. And then he talks about the three stages of practice. And then he talks about when we stumble over a stone or stumble on the earth, we should use the thing that we stumble over to help us up. And then he talks about city center being a monastery in its wider sense.

[09:15]

And then he talks about Soen Roshi's mysterious practice. So, I'll start off. I don't know how far I'll get, but maybe, I doubt if I'll get through the whole thing. But I'll just start. So he says, since we have Tassajara and also the city Zendo, our practice is more or less concentrated on one or the other of these places. But the most important point is to know what practice actually is, which includes both Tassajara and the city, so that wherever we are, Wherever we are, we can practice the way. No matter where you are, you must have the proper understanding of our practice. In Shobo Genzo, Genjo Koan, Dogen Zenji says, referring to this point, when all things are buddhadharma, there is birth and death, buddhas and sentient beings.

[10:21]

When all things are without self, there is no delusion, no buddhism, no buddha, no sentient beings, no birth and no death. When Buddhism, Buddhism originally goes beyond the duality of positive and negative, birth and death, defilement and enlightenment, and sentient beings and Buddha. So to go beyond the duality of positive and negative is our fundamental practice. It is better, I think, to follow the more original way of Zen practice, which is beyond Tassajara practice or the city Zendo practice. in the practice in the city, city zendo practice or practice in city life. Wherever we are, this is a fundamental practice for us. Otherwise, we will be too much involved in either the city practice or monastic practice, and I'm afraid we'll lose the point of practice. When all things are buddhadharma, there is defilement, practice, birth and death.

[11:26]

buddhas and sentient beings. That's Dogen speaking. The point is that all things are buddhism. Whatever you do, that is buddhism. But there is some danger here in understanding this kind of statement. It sounds like whatever we do doesn't matter because anyway that's the practice of buddhism. If that is so, it is not necessary to study buddhism. But actually what Dogen meant was not like that. So there may be two ways of understanding it. And then he starts to talk about should be and to be. So I'll just stop there. When Zen Center first started, when I first came to Zen Center, we only had the city practice at 1881 Bush Street, the old Sokoji. And everybody lived at home. except Suzuki Roshi and Oksan who lived in the temple just over the Zen-do.

[12:36]

And everybody would come to Zazen in the morning from wherever they lived. And they'd come to Zazen in the afternoon from wherever they lived. And nobody thought about it, that it would be any different. Eventually, we rented some places, some houses across the street from Zen Center, and people started living there. And that was the beginning of our kind of community living situation. But still, most people lived at home. And then, in 1969, we bought Page Street. And that began, that's when we began our residence practice. But still, a lot of people came to Zen Center from home.

[13:41]

And there wasn't a feeling of residence practice versus non-residence practice. It was pretty homogeneous. And all the time that Suzuki Roshi was alive, he was very much interested in lay people's practice and in city practice. And in 67, we got Tassajara. And that really changed things. We got Tassajara before the city center. And then Suzuki Roshi started ordaining people. He ordained most people after 1969, between 1970 and 71. And we started driving back and forth between Tassajara and the city.

[14:43]

And of course Suzuki Roshi wanted a monastic practice. and it was a great opportunity. I think the idea was that people would practice at Tassajara for a certain length of time and then go back and forth between Tassajara, between monastic practice and sitting practice. Because Zen Center became a residence practice, the lay practice started falling off. The emphasis on lay practice started falling off. Except maybe Green Gulch.

[15:47]

Green Gulch came after Suzuki Roshi. Green Gulch was Beg Roshi's baby. Suzuki Yoshi had nothing to do with that. But, one of the wonderful things about practicing in the city is, was always, our emphasis has always been, no matter what's going on, you should be able to find your practice. So, the cars going by, the people yelling on the street, all kinds of things going on while you're sitting zazen. And all the tempting and distracting things going on around you when you're not sitting zazen, when you're just at leisure in the city. So many things to occupy you.

[16:51]

These are two different aspects of practice and sometimes when we come to Tassajara, we get away from all that and it's wonderful to really isolate ourselves and let go of everything and just take up the practice of Tassajara, the monastic practice. And then when you leave Tassajara, and go back to the city to just take up that practice without flinching. A well-trained student should be able to go back and forth between Tassajara and city center or the city without it making any difference. Because our practice is we carry our practice with us.

[17:56]

Our practice is not dependent on some special place or some special routine. So the idea is when you practice in a place like Tassajara, Tassajara is constructed, put together in a way that creates an atmosphere for practice. And whatever you do, it's practice, because you're immersed in the atmosphere, and you know what it is, you're always reminded, moment by moment, of practice. And everybody around you is practicing, more or less. But when you go out to the city, you know, In many ways you're practicing, you could be practicing by yourself for long periods of time.

[19:02]

And then you have to create the atmosphere of practice out of the raw material that you run into. That's the great challenge of practice. Mature practice is to create practice out of the circumstances that you find yourself in. So it's the flip side. One side is given to you, and the other side you have to find. So both sides are wonderful and intriguing, but the side of having to find your practice within your circumstances That's the creative side of practice. The most disappointing thing to me is because residential practice is so strong, so dominant in Zen Center, that people think that that's the only way to practice.

[20:20]

And when people students leave Tassajara or leave the city center, they think that they're leaving practice. That's a big mistake. Big, big, big mistake. We should be practicing all the time, no matter where we are. If you go out to Timbuktu, you set up your practice in Timbuktu. You get up in the morning, it sits out there. It doesn't matter where you are. And then you practice through the day with whatever your activities are. Even if everybody around you has no idea what you're doing. This is how you establish practice wherever you are. How else can you possibly be a teacher? If you need to have a certain place and a certain structure in order to be a teacher, you're not a real teacher.

[21:30]

Or a real student. If your Zen practice depends on some special place or some special routine or some special people, you are not a real Zen student. So Suzuki Roshi is trying to tell us that we shouldn't be stuck or attached to some special place. Tassajara is great practice, but when you leave Tassajara, fine. You're practicing in your car, driving away from Tassajara. What's next? So you should be able to come and go very freely.

[22:36]

And when you leave, how do you find your practice? When you go out for vacation, how do you find your practice in vacation? When you visit your family, how do you practice with the family, which feels like almost impossible to do? How do you find your practice in the most impossible situation? That's good practice. That's why city center practice is so nice, so good, because it's so disturbing. So many disturbances. That's why a beginner's practice is so good, because you have so much trouble just sitting still. You have your problem right away. So then Suzuki Roshi says, one way to take this statement literally

[23:50]

One way is to... Okay, I'll go back a little bit. The statement he's talking about is that whatever you do, that's Buddhism, right? One way is to take this statement literally, that whatever you do is Buddhism or practice. One way is to take this statement literally from the point of view of your non-Buddhist understanding. The other is the real Buddhist understanding as in the Lotus Sutra where it says, shoho jiso. Shoho means that which we see, probably could be stated a little better than that, jiso is the true way or the way things really exist. So this statement means to see things the way they really are. Shoho means that which we see So the usual way to understand whatever you do that is Buddhism is that even though you do not behave or do not live in the way you should live, it's still Buddhism.

[25:06]

In other words, do what you want, you know, it's Buddhism, right? Charles Manson, Buddhism. But there's a big difference. What we have here may be, maybe, is the problem of to be and should be. Nowadays, people do not like the words should be. Should be and they like the words to be. Well, here he means, by to be he means what I like. What I should do and what I like to do, right? I don't know if this should be translated in a more easier to understand way, but this is the way you put it. But it bounces back and forth nicely this way, so it's nice to keep the language.

[26:07]

Should be and to be. Simple. Should be looks like rules, and to be seems like freedom. Whatever you do is okay. That is to be. But from the point of view of Shoho Jiso, should be is to be, or the way things really exist. The way things really exist is should be is to be. And then he chuckles. When you behave appropriately according to the circumstances, then that is should be. And that is also to be. When you... Should be is to be, and to be is should be, right? To be and should be are the same.

[27:11]

But when your selfish idea arises and rejects should be, rejects the way you actually exist, you are involved in the delusion of self. And in a strict sense, you cannot survive in that way. You may want to survive in that way, but it's not possible. If you want to go to Los Angeles, you should take Highway 101. People who are going south take 101, so I will go the opposite way, and eventually I'll reach Los Angeles. That's a stubborn way of thinking. Having freedom to choose is in that way is very good, but to know that it is not possible is another matter. If you sit seriously and at the same time try to do whatever you want to, that is delusion. It means that you are completely involved in delusion. It is not possible to survive in that way.

[28:13]

So, from the point of view of practice, should be and to be are not different. real freedom is in should-be and is also in to-be, in a true sense. Should-be is the way for beginners. And to-be, which is one with should-be, is the advanced student. Should-be, in other words, a beginner should just do what you should do. and give up what you want to do. If you come to Tassajara as a beginner, you should just do what you should do and not do what you want to do. You should forget all about what you want to do and just do what you should do. But later, for the advanced student, there is what you want to do.

[29:16]

But what you want to do and what you should do are the same. You know, Master Rinzai, the famous quote of Master Rinzai is, he says, I control the whole world. The whole world is under my control. And the monk said, how is that? And he said, everything is going exactly the way I want it to. So the first stage, should be, should be. And should be, should be, should be. An endless continuous practice of should be. You have no chance to get out of should be. That is okay. Pretty soon you will be to be. Should be or to be, you don't care.

[30:20]

Should be is okay. And 2B is okay. And because we can't reach it, we want it. Because we can't reach it, we want it. Because we want it. Because we can't reach it, we want it. Because we do not stay young forever, we want to be young always. So, you know, it's something that we can't have, and so we really want it. Something which is impossible to accept is something we like, or something that cannot be accepted, something like that. Something which is beyond our expectation is something that we like. That is our human nature. When you know our human nature deeply enough, then you will start to practice Buddhism.

[31:27]

It is like an operation. When the pain is strong enough to accept the operation, you will go to the doctor. But it is almost impossible to have an operation when you have no pain. I'm okay. Because you have a great pain, because you feel the pain of human nature deeply, enough, you will start to practice Buddhism. I have to read my revisions here in pencil, so that's why I'm leaning over to the right. And that's why you practice Zazen, because of your pain. We all come to this practice because of our pain. And sometimes, I was thinking about, there's sometimes, there was a time when only old people were coming to Zen Center.

[32:31]

You know, there was a time when a lot of young people came and that was when they started forming Tassajara and doing a lot of building. And then at some point it fell off. Young people were not coming to Zen Center anymore. Only middle-aged hippies. And people over 40, you know. thinking about that. And there are various reasons why that happens. But one reason why it happens is because people at that age begin to look at their lives and the pain in their lives and realize what's going on. They just realize the pain and suffering in their lives. Whereas when you're younger, you're still doing the uphill battle. I think that there is a way, you don't think so much about what's causing pain, and that your life is not going in the right direction.

[33:47]

But there are a lot of young people coming who have done something now, and it's wonderful. During the Reagan years, before the Reagan years, people had much better understanding of life. There were more young people. During the Reagan years, people had this illusion of success, and they stopped coming. And then, now, people are beginning to, there's a lot of realization about what's real. And we have more young people. That's very good. That makes life very vital. What time am I supposed to stop? At first, when you sit, many things, many confused ideas, and many thoughts from the past will come up.

[35:07]

We know that. Much of what we do makes us feel regretful. Sometimes we do things which feel good at the time, but afterwards, how do we feel? I thought it would feel good, but it was not so good. That's a quote. What? Yeah. That is some feeling you will have. That kind of feeling will come up when your mind is very calm in zazen. It is like a bubble coming up from the bottom of the water. When the water is rough enough, no bubbles will come up. Or if they do come up, you will not notice. As soon as your mind becomes clear, you notice how many bubbles you have at the bottom of your heart. And real practice starts from here. We say that to have calmness of mind is real practice. So you may feel, I have been practicing two or three or more years and I still don't have calmness in my mind.

[36:18]

In Zazen practice we say that if anything arises in your mind, let it arise, let it come. then it does not stay so long and it will go away. In Zazen that works pretty well. If you let the thoughts come and do not entertain them, they will go away. But in daily life it's not so easy. You may suffer. When the suffering is very strong, what will you do? And then he talks about the three stages. He just leaves it there. When the suffering is strong, what will you do? You'll be puzzled. So then he talks about three stages. Three stages? You should know, then, that your practice is in the first stage. This is a kind of description of the first stage. In the second stage, you feel that you have very good zazen practice.

[37:25]

your mind will be completely calm, in complete calmness for a while, where there is no image and no feeling. You feel, you know, all that turbulence is like gone, and you feel very calm and like you're really into it, you know. And that's the second stage. And the third stage is sort of like the first stage. And the third stage will be something like the first stage, where you are aware of many problems, where there are many weeds and many flowers. But the way you see the flowers and the way you approach the weeds is different. The third stage looks like the first stage, but there is a big difference. So instead of trying to solve all the problems of the first stage,

[38:29]

you continue that practice along with the difficulties you will have. If you struggle at the first stage, you will lose your practice. That is why we say that great patience is the best of virtues. But to continue without struggling is the most important point. Then you will be ready for the second stage or the third stage. So the first stage is we bring our life with us. and it's all bubbling up. And if we're too disturbed by it, we can't continue. We just have to let it kind of work itself out until finally the mind becomes calm. And we're no longer worried about it. But then after that comes the third stage where things come up And it's a more mature approach.

[39:35]

In other words, you can be the director of Tassajara, and when you sit Zazen, if you're the director of Tassajara, when you sit Zazen, all the problems of Tassajara will come up in your Zazen. You'll be thinking about it continually. But it won't bother you. You don't care. If that comes up, okay. If it doesn't come up, it's okay. You just sit zazen with whatever comes up. So you have more responsibilities and you're able to handle yourself without getting thrown by anything. So it's like the first stage, except that it's more mature. You have both the first stage and the second stage as a foundation. So if we want to hang on to the calmness of the first stage, then we have a problem.

[40:43]

Because the more we try to hold on to the calmness of the second stage, the more we try to hold on to the calmness of the second stage, the more problem we have. And then we start complaining Oh, my mind is very disturbed. Something's always coming up. Of course. The function of the mind is to be thinking. It's a very strong thing you have up here. It wants to leave. It wants to take over. But the mind, thinking mind, has to take its place and doesn't like to do that. thinking mind is the monkey. There was a wonderful play called Journey to the West, which is now playing, but you won't be able to see it. You saw it, yeah. And it's, you know, there's this Chinese novel, which is dating from the 16th, 15th or 16th century,

[41:56]

about the Monkey King. And the Monkey King, to make a long story short, the Monkey King is ordered to accompany Xuanzang to India to bring back the scriptures to China in the 7th century. And the monkey can do anything. The monkey has learned all the Taoist tricks and can leap over the moon. But the Buddha, he has a contest with the Buddha, and the Buddha says to him, OK, let's have a contest. If you can leap into my hand and find the extent and find the borders of my hand, you win."

[43:02]

So, Muggy's, okay, and he jumps in and he goes to the end of the earth. He says, well, here I am at the end of the earth. And there are these two pillars, big trees that are sticking out. And he walks over to one and does something, and then he walks over to the other one and takes a leak. on it, pees on it. And then he hops back, you know, he says, well, I went to the end of the earth. And the Buddha says, oh yes, this is the tree that you peed on. See that there? So the monkey has to, she says, no, well, the way to redeem yourself is to accompany Xuanzang to India and be his guardian. And along the way they pick up a pig and another monk, and the three of them are the guardians for Xuanzang on his route, on his trip, and they go through all his adventures.

[44:12]

But the point is that the monkey is the mind. Each one is symbolic of something. Xuanzang, the monk, is this symbol of purity and determination and straight thinking and so forth, but he's very naive. So he's always walking into these situations with his eyes open, you know, dangerous situations with his eyes open. He can't see what's happening. He's just this, you know, pure embodiment of purity. But he needs the mind. He needs the mind to help him in these situations, you know. So it's like the balance of the heart and the mind. of wisdom and compassion and working in harmony with each other. So the spirit, pure spirit is here, right, and the mind takes its place in helping to guide or helping to protect the spirit.

[45:21]

When the mind doesn't recognize the spirit, then it puts itself in first place and becomes cunning and dangerous. So our mind is always working, but the mind has to be under control. But you can't stop the mind because the mind is too clever. Like the monkey, nothing can stop the monkey. Nobody. He completely trashed heaven and earth. Until he was under control. And Xuanzang got this iron crown which he presented to the monkey, he said, oh, put this on, you'll really like this.

[46:34]

And the monkey, OK, he put it on. But it was, this is the way that Xuanzang could control the monkey. Because whenever the monkey wanted to do something on his own, Xuanzang went zap, and the crown started squeezing his head. until Xuanzang stopped it and then he behaved. So he knew. Early shock therapy. What? Early shock therapy. Early shock therapy. Right. So anyway, that's the story of the mind and the heart. The mind should be under the control of the heart and not the other way around. So he says, so instead of trying to solve all the problems of the first stage, you should continue with that practice along with the difficulties you will have.

[47:44]

If you struggle at the first stage, you lose your practice. That is why we say that great patience is the best of virtues. Just to continue without struggling is the most important point. Then you will be ready for the second stage and the third stage. Then, he talks about stumbling. When someone stumbles and falls to the earth, by way of the earth, they will stand up. In other words, when you stumble, then you push yourself up by putting your hand on the ground. Because something causes you to stumble, you fall to earth. But because of the Earth, you can support yourself again and stand up. You may have a complaint and feel that because of the Earth, you fell. Without the Earth, you cannot fall.

[48:50]

And without the Earth, you cannot stand up. Falling and standing up is a great help which is given to you by the Earth. So the problem itself is your mother. Because of the mother, which is the earth, you can continue your practice. So whatever your problem is, right, is you use your problem to help you instead of being used by your problem. Instead of being a victim of your problem, instead of being a victim of your problem, you use your problem to help you. You deal with your problem by way of your problem. So, Siddhiji Arjuna is always saying, the problem you have is a great treasure. Don't try to get rid of your problems. We always want to get rid of our problems so we can have it some other way.

[49:52]

As soon as you get rid of your problem, another problem will take its place. So, you should be grateful for the problem you have now. Maybe not so good to try to get rid of it. Because whatever it is that's in front of us is the thing that we have to bring us to life. We like nice things to bring us to life. But the thing that's in front of us is not nice or not nice. It's just our attitude that makes it so. So whenever we fall down, Or whenever we're confronted with something, it's an opportunity for an adventure. If you fall down into a chasm, you have the opportunity for an adventure. How do I get up? How do I deal with this?

[50:54]

So we're always ready to accept something that we have to deal with because we have nothing else to do. So he says, it is within the zendo of the great earth that you have your problem. That's a wonderful statement. The whole earth is our zendo. Problems are actually our zendo. So what is delusion and what is enlightenment? When you are deluded about earth, that is delusion. And when you are enlightened about earth, That is enlightenment. When you stand up by the earth, that is enlightenment. When you fall, you fell because of the earth. That is delusion. So you have a chance to attain great enlightenment when you have problems. It is okay to talk about the siddhi practice and monastic practice, but the point of practice in either place will be the earth.

[52:02]

So if Tassajara is a monastery, City Center is a monastery in its wide sense. So our way is not to get rid of all the stones from the earth, which could be a stumbling block for us. It is good to have many stones, which could be stumbling blocks. And when you stand up, if you have a big stone, it may be easier to stand up. You say, big passion, big Buddha. We have a big problem with the possibility of big enlightenment. No problem, no enlightenment.

[53:08]

Suzuki Roshi used to say that most Zen masters, most good Zen masters had big problems in their practice when they were young. Okay, so I will end here. Okay.

[53:49]

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