Morning. Morning. This morning, I'm going to comment on case number 79 in the Blue Cliff record. So here's the introduction. presents the introduction to this case.

[01:28]

When his great function manifests before you, it doesn't keep to patterns and rules. He captures you alive without exerting superfluous effort. But say, who has ever acted in this way? To test, I'm citing this old case. Take a look. presents the case. He says, a monk asked, Tsu-tsu, all sounds are the sounds of Buddha, right or wrong? Tsu-tsu said, right. The monk said, teacher, doesn't your asshole make farting sounds? Tsu-tsu then hit him. Again, the monk asked, coarse words or subtle talk?

[02:35]

All returns to the primary meaning. Right or wrong? Tutsu said, right. The monk said, can I call you an ass teacher? Tutsu then hit him. And then Shui Tu has a verse. He says, Tutsu, Tutsu, the wheel of his ability is unobstructed. He releases one and gets two. The same for that, the same for this. How pitiful. Innumerable people playing in the tide. In the end, fall into the tide and die. If they suddenly came to life, the hundred rivers would reverse their flow with a rushing, roaring noise.

[03:37]

So I will go back and take these one by one. When his great function manifests before you, this is the introduction, it doesn't keep to patterns and rules. The great function is the great function of the universe. Here it also means great use. We say great function is like great use. There's the potential of universal life energy. and it manifests in each one of us and the way we use this or the way we allow this energy to be used is up to each one of us.

[04:40]

Here he's pointing to Tutsu who manifests But it doesn't keep to patterns and rules. The monk thought that he could trap Tutsu. And so he presented something and thought that Tutsu would follow suit. But Tutsu doesn't keep to patterns and rules. His great function doesn't conform to patterns and rules. So, when his great function manifests before you, it doesn't keep to patterns and rules. He captures you alive without exerting superfluous effort. He doesn't have to do anything but be himself.

[05:44]

This is the great function of someone who has this ability. They don't have to try to do something. But say, who has ever acted in this way? To test, I'm citing this old case. So he's setting it up so you understand what's going on, or giving you a pointer as to what's going on in this case. So in the case, the monk asked Tutsu. Tutsu, I believe, is Totsu Gisei. He said, the monk asked Tutsu, all sounds are the sounds of Buddha, right or wrong? Well, this is a fair question. It's a fair assessment. We know, if you study Buddhism, you know that all sounds are the sounds of Buddha, right or wrong?

[06:52]

As soon as he heard right or wrong, Tutsu should have understood what was going on. It's okay to say all sounds are the sounds of Buddha, right or wrong. There's a poem. The various sutras have poems that are something like this. Streams and birds, trees and woods, all recite the name of the Buddha, the honor of the Dharma, the peace of the Sangha. That's a nice katha. So, all sound. But the monk is setting a trap for Tutsi.

[08:05]

In Xue Tu's commentary, he says, this monk had taken his views of sound and form Buddhism and stuck them to his forehead. He probably thought, all is one, that no matter what you say, it's the voice of the Buddha. I mean, it's very logical. There's the wisdom of great equality. When ego becomes transformed into wisdom, is called the wisdom of great equality, where you see all things as having the same nature with your own eyes.

[09:13]

So possibly this monk had stuck that on his forehead, all is one. But although he had this idea that all is one, he didn't understand the second wisdom, which is all is different. There is a hierarchy of differentiation where everything stands out in its own individuality, and it's not the same as anything else. And if you don't understand both of these, you get hung up. So obviously this monk didn't understand the wisdom of differentiation.

[10:18]

He only thought he understood the wisdom of equality. So he says, all sounds are the sounds of Buddha. right or wrong. He's setting a trap. He's not a bad monk. He's pretty smart. Maybe he's trying to see where the teacher is. Maybe he's trying to upset him, upset his seat. So Tutsu, being a very straightforward fellow, said, right. He didn't try to get around it, he just stepped into the middle of the circle. And he said, right, without thinking any further. And so the monk said, teacher, doesn't your asshole make farting sounds?

[11:19]

And Tutsu hit him. What is hitting? Maybe he... what would he have expected Tutsu to do? What would you have done? Stay verbal. That's what the monk expected. But he didn't get it. He didn't get what he expected. He got a blow instead. Ouch! This is where someone could have used words. Maybe Joshu would have said something.

[12:23]

What would you say besides just words? What was he showing the monk anyway? The monk seemed like he was playing games. The monk was playing games. I'm not going to play your game. Bam. Again, the monk asked, he's coming back for more. Again, the monk asked, coarse words or subtle talk? all returns to the primary meaning. He's still on the same kick. There's a saying, a koan, all things return to the one.

[13:28]

Where does the one return to? Horse words or subtle talk all returns to the primary meaning. Right or wrong? So by this time, Tutsu must have been a little disgusted with him. He's asking the same question again, only in a different way. But Tutsu uses the same answer. He said, because Tutsu doesn't have to try to do anything. All he has to do is answer the question. He said, that's right. He'll answer the same way to the same question, or to each question. Same answer. Yes, that's right.

[14:32]

And the monk said, can I call you an ass, teacher? Tutsu hid. He should have learned his lesson the first time. But it's very interesting that he would ask again. It makes a better story in the second part. We say, you should treat everyone as yourself. When you speak to somebody, how do you address someone?

[15:45]

There are all these Zen stories about the teachers and students talking to each other with coarse words and upsetting each other's seat and hitting each other. But if one doesn't have the proper understanding, then all this kind of interplay is just degenerative. Coarse words and subtle words. The monk asked, coarse words or subtle talk all return to the primary meaning. Coarse words means, Lao Tzu says, the greatest eloquence is like stuttering.

[16:57]

This is coarse words. But the mokpa course words meant insulting words or manipulative words or challenging words which are insulting. Not so nice. Not nice words. Unkind words. That's what he thought that coarse meant. But he didn't understand that coarse words meant great eloquence expressed in a simple way. Whereas subtle expressions were more refined. So the real meaning, coarse words or subtle words, this is actually from a sutra.

[18:08]

He was quoting a sutra. Subtle words meaning very refined and well worked out and sophisticated. Coarse words meaning just the utterance of someone who doesn't have the skill, but the truth is there. Like, there's an example, this very famous rabbi in Poland in the 18th century, in his congregation, I'm trying to remember the story exactly, it's fading from my memory, but People were trying to express their understanding of the Torah.

[19:11]

And there was a little boy in the congregation, and he had a little whistle. And in the middle of all this, he took out his whistle and blew his whistle. And everybody was astonished. And the rabbi said, this is the true expression. So this is like course words. Then, Shui Tu has a verse. He says, Totsu, Totsu, the wheel of his ability is unobstructed. He releases one and gets two. One word, yes. He gets two victories. with one word, yes. The same for that, the same for this.

[20:18]

That's like two, each blow, the same blow for that, the same blow for this. So Tutsu, just acting as himself, yes, yes, bam, bam. He didn't have to do much to control this muck. Just be himself. Was asked the question? Yes, that's right. Even though he knew it was a trap. But actually the monk climbed onto his hook and then got him. And then he says, how pitiful innumerable people playing in the tide in the end fall into the tide and die. This is a typical expression. The tide is like tutsu. If someone plays in the tide, they should know how it comes in and goes out.

[21:24]

Otherwise it gets stuck. When you're playing against something as strong as the tide, you should be careful. Otherwise you can easily get caught by it. So the monk was caught by Tutsu's tide. But he says, if they suddenly come to life, the hundred rivers would reverse their flow with a rushing, roaring noise. In other words, if a monk had responded in the right way to Tutsu, he might have overturned the whole thing. But alas, he didn't. This monk Shui Tu is giving the monk a lot of credit. He's saying, if he had shown some real ability in the end, things might have turned out okay for him. But he couldn't do that.

[22:27]

He couldn't stand up against Shui Tu's, yes, bam. Shui Tu says, if the monk had When Shui Tu picked up his stick, if the monk had grabbed his seat and turned it over, then the hundred rivers may have reversed themselves, and so forth. So this monk was going on a... probably going around testing out his single line with everybody. He thought that he'd really hit on something. He really thought that he'd hit on something.

[23:32]

And he was going to go around and test it with everybody. And when he came to Tutsu, he got stopped. So all sounds are the sounds of Buddha's voice. Right or wrong? Yes, but if you think that everything is just equal, you get a big blow at some point, whether from Tutsu or someplace else. This is living in, this is all sounds of the sounds of Buddha voice is ultimate reality.

[24:38]

But as Akin Roshi says, this is not where we live. We live also in the relative sphere, where if you insult somebody, you might get hit. Where there are responses to whatever you do. The world responds to all of your actions. So you have to be careful. We all have to be careful how we address the universe, how we address each other, and be willing to take whatever response comes to us from our actions. So, a good lesson for the monk. Tutsu was a good teacher. not convincible through words, only convincible through actions.

[25:49]

So Totsu hit him. The other side of his question. Do you have any question? Yes. Come closer. All things return to the One, so where does the One return to? Yes. Oh, you're asking me that question? Is there any place where things stop? There's a saying by Huckawin.

[27:12]

He said, the going to, the coming from, within the coming from, within the going to. I'll say that again. The coming from, within the going to, the going to, within the coming from. It's always turning over. It's always turning over, or turning around continuously. I don't want to say what it's doing, but... If you make definitive statements... I don't want to make definitive statements, but we can point to it. That's used as various metaphors, and that metaphor is used in various ways.

[28:52]

But one should be able to come in and out with the tide. If you stand there when the tide is coming, you get washed over. So, you know, the little birds, they know just how to do it. On the beach, you know, the wave comes in, and the wave goes out, and they go... It seems to me there's an important moral dimension to this koan. I'm doing evil, but sometimes it's not always so easy to tell which is which when my personal stuff gets in the way.

[30:13]

So, I'm asking you, teacher, where you have to act in response to something which may be, in relative terms, evil. What do you rely on? Well, all is one, and there is still good and evil. Sometimes one has to think, is this good or is this evil? And then sometimes one just has to act and take the consequences.

[31:25]

So If you practice, if you practice what you feel is good, with the understanding of what is difference between what is good and what is evil, if you practice that, then when you have to act, you'll be more likely to act, if you don't have time to think, you'll be more likely to act, given what your foundation is, on the basis of that foundation.

[32:30]

It's like, People, someone says, I'm angry all the time, always angry. How can I stop being angry? Or how can I stop reacting in an angry way? Well, you can say all kinds of things, but it doesn't help. One has to practice not being angry as a practice. When you practice it as a practice, like whenever you know, to be careful about how you respond to things, then when you respond, you respond through that foundation. But to just get an idea about how to act without anger, you may be able to do it once or twice, but it's not consistent. So one has to practice not being angry.

[33:36]

One has to practice doing the right thing. And then when you respond, you respond from who you are. So we're always responding from who we are. We can't just fix ourselves easily. I don't say it's impossible, but it's mostly we have to practice what we do. We can't just decide I'm not going to be angry. It rarely works. Did that answer your question? Maybe too much of an answer. I'm sorry about that. I didn't know that you had a question. Well, just on that same point, so, are you saying that on the one hand, there is no difference between good and evil, and then on the other hand, there is?

[34:38]

Yes. On the one hand, things are just what they are. But from the human point of view, there is good and evil. Good and evil only exist from the human point of view. And since we're humans, we have to act according to good and evil, our understanding of good and evil, and understand at the same time that there is no such thing intrinsically. But even though that's true, it's not where we live. We live in this realm where duality of good and evil. And we want people to be either happy or unhappy. You know, when we read the Chant the Metta Sutra, may all beings be happy, that's our wish.

[35:48]

But not everybody wishes that. Some people wish, may all beings be unhappy. They do. So you have various kinds of human beings. Or they May we be happy at the expense of others. That's one of our comments. Yes? I must respectfully say, had you not said who was the teacher and who was the student, I would have thought the monk as the teacher. Well, we're not talking about children here. We're talking about people who understand the interplay of this stuff.

[36:56]

But it's a good point because the student was trying to be the teacher. And so I can see how one would say, well, yeah, Which one was the teacher? Because the student was trying to be the teacher and the teacher was showing him something about that. He wasn't ready to do that yet. you're going to respond in a second, more so, because your foundation is that way. But a lot of times I find, if I'm reading or contemplating, I feel really good, I can handle almost any situation.

[37:59]

I can think of a situation. But once in a while, I'm not feeling the right way, a situation will arise, you know, where I can't believe I'll be in such a situation. All right. Well, thinking of the bike, what if Somebody took the bike away? Well, if somebody took your bike, well, you can walk. And if there's no place to go, you can sit. There's always a way.

[39:08]

We feel that we need equipment to do something, and so we have all kinds of equipment. But actually, it's good to find out that you can do without equipment. You can do a lot without equipment. Finally, what is there to steal? Finally, what is there to keep? And one of the... the heart of this practice is that there's nothing to hang on to. You know, there's a story of Ryokan. who came back to his hut in the middle of the night and found out that somebody had stolen all of his stuff.

[40:17]

And it was a moon full night. He said, I wish he hadn't gone. I would have given him this beautiful moon to take with him as well. run around and be noisy and get into fights and break things, and then they have no boundaries. But if we make a distinction between sacred and profane, then we are liable to get upset and angry and hit them or yell. That's really good. I don't know if you heard what Raul said, but he said, I'll try to say what he said,

[41:19]

It's a good koan for people that have children, because if all is one and you just let them go, the sacred profane is no difference, and you don't put any restrictions on them, then before long they're destroying everything and kind of doing whatever they want and annoying society. And if you do put restrictions on them, then We get angry and start yelling and hitting. So that's a great tension there. What do you do? This has been the calling of every parent. that it's in this intimate Sindho setting.

[42:32]

I hear this koan, the responses, the blows, and the question. There's two stages. And the first stage is not setting boundaries. put it down, cut through it. And then the second stage is, to my mind, the boundary setting. Even if you set it aside, as you said, there's still the here and now. For words and actions, there are consequences. comes out of, it's like, again, returning, remembering that we're in this world, the first thing is to draw your ego persisting in questions that are rooted in ego.

[43:45]

Yeah, and one of the commentaries, Shui Tzu says, and Tzu brought him up from behind. Well, I want to say some words. But I'm not as brave as he is usually. He took a risk. And even, I mean, you could see that he was persistent, really doggedly stupid by doing it again. But by asking those questions and by coming right up under his teacher's nose like that, he said, can I call you and ask? He was being a smart aleck, but maybe. Yeah, he was.

[44:51]

But at any rate, he put himself in line for those blows so we could have the story. Yeah, he did it all for us. You know, I paste things on my forehead all the time. That's my career. And I often wonder whether to just keep on repeating this. You know, I haven't been hit physically yet by a teacher. Too bad. You know, I don't know. But anyway. Obviously, I haven't. But you have been hit by life. Yeah. But I don't know, stay out of them. I don't know whether to just keep quiet if I know I'm basing it on my forehead or whether to go, I usually go ahead and talk. Stick is like, you know, symbolic of something unexpected that cuts off our thing.

[45:54]

That cuts off our, you know, Life is like that. That's what the stick represents, actually. It's not like beating up children or, you know, punishment or anything like that. It's like life bringing you up short. I know on one level all hitting is the same. All hitting is the same. It's like all styles are the same. But it sounds like you're saying, in a way, that every time you're hit by life, it's the same as being hit by the monk's dick. No. That's carrying it too far. Okay. That's what I was hoping you'd say. That's carrying a metaphor too far. Okay. Because there are times when life hits you without the same wisdom or right action. Yeah, of course. Of course. There are no rules.

[46:57]

I found this discussion very helpful, and I find it helpful often when life hits me. a right action, and a long time later you find out, no, that wasn't the right action. And I haven't heard you really answer the question I asked before, which is, what do you rely on to know you're on the right track? Well, I could say intuition. I want to interject at this point and say I think this story is about levels of understanding and the stick to me is an intervention beyond verbal.

[48:35]

Intuition beyond verbal. Life hitting you. Something happening in your body. Something happening in your family. To me, it's about levels of understanding. And I don't know if the student was a smart aleck. Maybe the student was, maybe the student wasn't. Maybe the student was asking genuine, authentic questions, but that's just where the student was. And I guess the koan of life is, to me, it's the not knowing. You know, not knowing. And then if I'm in that situation and I respond in a way that I later know if I had to do it again, I'd like to do it differently, that helps me move closer to perhaps to what I'd like to do.

[49:40]

I mean, it's just, it's riding the vibe. But I don't know, I think maybe that's all you get. I don't know. So I'm not a parent, so at the risk of being assaulted, wouldn't it make more sense just to accept that there is no right way to raise children? Basically. I would say basically not so. But when you say right, you mean a rule. What does one respond with?

[50:51]

What do you rely on when you raise children or have to do something? I would say intuition. And what I mean by intuition is being not separate, or being one with the child, and at the same time being two. One and two. And everything is done with compassion. And punishment is done with compassion. One never loses sight of that fact.

[51:59]

So, to be able to... Maybe, maybe, you know, what you rely on is understanding, right? But you don't understand. You really don't understand. But you rely on understanding. You rely on understanding what you don't understand. And there are no fixed rules. There's a lot to say, but, you know, if you want to boil it down, it's hard to boil down to one thing. By intuition, I mean directly knowing.

[53:05]

Directly knowing means without the intervention of thinking. Before thinking, it's like I rely on my gut response. That's what I rely on. That's my answer. There's a lot of questions, but it's getting too late.

[53:31]

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