Well, as most of you know, I was in Japan for a few weeks, and I came home a couple of days ago. And I went to Japan to do a ceremony called Zuisei, which is a ceremony of Well, after one has Dharma transmission, then it's customary to go to the head temples, Eheji and Sojiji, the Soto school, and you lead the morning service.

[01:03]

and they treat you very nicely and it's a kind of confirmation by the Soto school or the head temples and of your well maybe rank or confirmation as a fully confirmed teacher. And they give you permission to spread the Dharma. Of course, in America, we've been doing everything kind of backwards and we've already created a whole Dharma situation, which doesn't quite fit or match with the Japanese model.

[02:12]

And also, it's very unusual for Westerners to have this kind of ceremony in Japan, because unless one is trained in Japan, they don't recognize you're training outside of Japan. But all this is kind of changing now, and I'll explain that a little bit, how it's changing. I think we're kind of pioneering the relationship between Japan and the United States, which has been neglected for quite a long time. When I was in Japan, in Tokyo, actually, I heard about the earthquake. I was at the Shumucho, Soto Shumucho Hotel in Tokyo.

[03:20]

The Soto sect has offices in a hotel that they own, 15-story hotel in Tokyo, called the Grand Hotel. Grand Hotel. There was an old movie, you know, called Grand Hotel. And about two hours after the earthquake, we saw the movies on television. And we could see a lot that had happened. The fires in the marina, and the bridge, and the freeway. we were very concerned and quite frustrated because there was nothing we could do and we couldn't even communicate because it was they said that we shouldn't that foreigners shouldn't try to call or people shouldn't try to call into San Francisco. So it was very frustrating not to be able to communicate or call

[04:27]

So we had that on our minds at the same time that we were doing all this stuff. But we just had to kind of go ahead and do what we had to do and not think too much about it, not think too much about the earthquake. It was a kind of whirlwind trip, a lot of things to do because we had to do these ceremonies at two different places. One was in Soji-ji, which is... Soji-ji is the temple that was created by... Keizo Hamzenji, thank you. by Kaizan Zenji, three generations after Dogen.

[05:34]

And then we had to go to Eheji, which was the monastery that was founded by Dogen, and do the same ceremony, only a little differently. At each place, they do the ceremony a little differently. The two head temples have a little bit of rivalry going, and they do things differently. Soji-ji is a little more laid-back practice, and Ehe-ji is more of a sharp, hard practice. And you can feel the difference between the two places. But anyway, we had to go by train. In Japan, you travel a lot by train. And we had to put on all our robes and get on the train. and go from Tokyo to Yokohama and then walk with our bags to Sochigi. And then when we got through there, we had to get on the train in our robes and go to Eheji, which is more in the mountains.

[06:45]

And we had to be there on time. So it was a lot of quick timing, and we didn't really have time to think too much about what was going on. but we kept getting reports about how things were here in San Francisco. So it was myself and Reb Anderson from Zen Center in San Francisco and Bill Kwong from Sonoma Mountain and Les Kay from Mountain View Zen Do. The four of us had already been had been installed as abbots. And so it was a couple of years ago that we decided to do this. And at the time, the way to do something like this ceremony was to fake it. Fake your ordination.

[07:47]

You know, in Japan this is quite common. If you want to get around the bureaucracy, you have to kind of fake things. And we didn't want to do that. You know, here we felt we've been practicing for 25 years and we kind of earned what we have and we didn't want to fake something to say that we had done all of our practice in Japan and have people sign papers and so forth. And so I was about ready to forget the whole thing. But then Hoitsu, Roshi, our teacher in Japan, said, come on over and we'll do it in October. And he didn't explain it very much. So we just went ahead.

[08:48]

But when we got to Tokyo, the Shumucho, Shumucho is the organization of the Soto sect, the council of the Soto sect. And they're very rigid and rule-bound. And although they peek at us, you know, they look at us, they'd see what we're doing, And they actually know that what we're doing is real practice. As a matter of fact, they know that our practice is more strict than theirs. And we actually pay more attention to the fundamentals of practice than they do. They understand this. But still, traditionally, they have to go by tradition. And the teachers that have come to America have all been kind of renegades. They've all been going around the establishment, and they felt a lot of freedom to do what they wanted to do in America, which they couldn't really do very well in Japan.

[10:08]

And so the establishment has always felt ignored by them. but they want to heal the wounds and they want to, there's some effort on their part to want to see how we can relate. So we spent a couple of days actually talking to the forum, what's called the missionary, department and the missionary department is kind of in between us and the establishment and their job is to take care of and communicate with the foreigners but they haven't done a very good job of it and they know that so they made this attempt to talk to us about it

[11:20]

And so it looks like it's hard to tell exactly what will happen, but they would like to be able to send people here and for us to send people there and to make, actually create some kind of communication and see how we can practice together, if possible. That will probably take a long time. and maybe even change some of their rules, which is really a big thing, because they don't like to change their rules. You know, it used to be that if someone was ordained here in America and they went to Japan to study, they would have to be ordained again, which is a kind of slap in the face, so to speak. It's like not recognizing what's happened here.

[12:25]

But they can't not recognize it because what's happened in America in our Zen practice can't be ignored. So they know that. And so the interaction that we've had with Japanese priesthood has been on a more personal basis with certain monks who are sympathetic with us and who we feel an affinity with. So those are the people that we communicate with and have an affinity with. So whether or not we want to get mixed up with bureaucracy is another thing. I don't know. We're pretty safe here. And Suzuki Roshi was very, he didn't want us to get too mixed up with bureaucracy of the Soto school.

[13:31]

And he kind of protected us from that. And they kind of didn't like that so much. But he wanted, he felt that it would be nice if we could reform the Soto school, which It seemed like an undertaking nobody wanted to take on. But I think he kept us kind of isolated from that so that we could develop our own way. And I feel that we've developed our own way for the past 25 years. Even though we're still kind of children at it, still we have some confidence in our practice. And so we have some basis or some way to relate. If we didn't have that confidence, it would be very hard to relate. For instance, in Europe, you know, Deshimaru Roshi went to Europe, went to Paris, and created the Paris Zendo, and people from all over Europe went there.

[14:45]

And when he died, some of his students created various zendos in Italy and Germany and countries in Europe. But those people haven't had the maturity of practice that we have had in America because they started a lot later. And so they need the Japanese, they need to lean on the Japanese more. So the Japanese have been giving them more attention and they understand this. This practice in America is much more established and actually in a very strict way. Hideshimaru is a very loose person and

[15:48]

sometimes when his students come to America to practice with us, it's difficult for them because we're more strict than they've been. So anyway, there's this whole kind of sangha outside of Japan now and the Japanese have to recognize that and they have to give us some credit and recognize our practice. And I think that they're willing to do that, and they want to do it, and they want to know how to do it, and they know that it's hard. But I think it's a very good thing. Even though it's difficult, and even though sometimes I feel a little anxious about it, I think it's a good thing because isolation is not so good, and communication is good, and doing something together is good, and I think we still have a lot to learn. There's a lot of resource in Japan for our practice.

[16:57]

I think it would be good, actually, for people to learn Japanese and be able to speak. When I was in Japan, I felt very frustrated because I couldn't speak Japanese. And there's something about the language and also being able to read the characters as a way to study. We read translations when we study. But to be able to read and study the characters gives you a much more direct and subtle kind of understanding. So this was the high point for me, for all of us, I think, was this meeting with the Soto Shu Shumucho and discussing with him how we could actually do something, communicate together.

[18:22]

And they also have what's called a Tokubetsu Sesshin, which they hold every other year for one month. It's not exactly a Sesshin, it's more of a study period where all the foreign people from the foreign countries practice with them. And they've had a couple of them so far, which no one has been able to go to, or very few of us have been able to go to. because they always announce it a month before. But we told them, give us a year's notice and hold it in September instead of October. So they feel that that's one way for them to open up to us. Paul Disko went last year and found it very, very good.

[19:27]

Maybe you have some, if you have a question, you can feel free to ask something. Yes? Yeah, so far no women have gone, but last year we wanted to send a woman and they said it was okay. As a matter of fact, Katagiri Roshi led it in Japan last year. And we were all set to send a woman and she couldn't go at the last minute. Yes. Yeah, women in Japan, well, women in Japan are treated very differently than the monks.

[20:50]

They don't practice at the head temples, excuse me, the other monasteries. But I think for foreigners, also, it's discouraged, actually. Foreigners are not encouraged to practice at AHE. It's just too difficult, the language. And also, it's geared toward young monks. The Japanese system is very different than our system. What happens is that most of the people that go to those temples are children of priests. Not everyone, but mostly. So they're brought up in a temple, usually, And then they go to college.

[21:52]

And the college is a Soto Zen college. And then after college they go to Eheji or Soji-ji for three years. And then they come out and they're ready to inherit the family temple. And they do Zazen when they're in Eheji or Soji-ji, but then when they come out they don't do it anymore. It's just part of their training, but it's not part of their life. So it's a kind of family thing, you know, as well. And in America, everybody comes to practice the opposite way, outside of, you know, the family thing. for us to follow their pattern doesn't make sense. And also it's geared toward those youths who are just out of college.

[23:02]

So the pace and the energy is just too difficult for Westerners who don't speak, who don't understand the language intimately. Because, well, for one thing, they move so quickly, the monks move so quickly that they don't have time to think. They don't have time to reflect, really. They're just going all the time, with no space in between their activities. And, of course, they're in the monastery, so they don't have to worry about things, you know. just do whatever is next. One thing after the other without really, without having to think too much. And so their minds become actually quite pure and alert. But it's only for that space of time.

[24:06]

And it's very hard for, if you don't understand the language, you can't move that fast, you can't understand what people are saying. So some Westerners have done it, and they do have a few Westerners, but they always recommend that people come back here. In the past 10 or 15 years, when people go to Japan, they always say, oh, you should go to California. They have a wonderful monastery in Tassajara for you, which is true. And actually, our practice at Tassajara, we do more Zazen than they do at Eheji. So, they recognize us, actually, but systematically, they can't include us. It's hard for them to include us.

[25:09]

Yes. Zuisei, yeah. Yeah, as a matter of fact, when we did it at Soji-ji, there was a Japanese monk who did it with us. And when we did it at Ehe-ji, there was a young nun who did it with us. And it was kind of interesting for her to be with us because doing it with four Americans. It was a novel experience for her, and for us, but more for her, I think, because the women don't usually practice with the men. So, these were things that we discussed with the Shimbu Cho, too, you know, women practicing, and they understood all this, you know, but still, We had to talk a lot about it. What was your experience with the service?

[26:27]

Well, everything was very quick. My experience was they really do things fast here. The service was so fast, you know, that you're just bowing. You just had to bow and get up, bow and get up, bow and get up. I remember Suzuki Roshi used to say in Japan, you know, that at the AHE and Soji-ji that the monks do so many memorial services that the service takes a long time. Morning service really takes a long time. And so they do it very quickly to get it over with. But... He wanted us to do things more slowly and to take our time. We didn't need to do all that. And he didn't want us to get caught up in doing lots of memorial services either. I understand that it's fairly routine in a priest's development to get dharma practice.

[27:28]

Is it also fairly routine for you to do it? What did Zoe say? What Zoe said is something that you do within a year after dharma transmission. It's kind of automatic. What's happened in Japan is that dharma transmission has become rather routine. After you graduate from the monastery and then you go back to your home temple and you have dharma transmission. So dharma transmission doesn't have the meaning, kind of lost the meaning that it should have. And Suzuki Roshi wanted to maintain the meaning. So he didn't want us to just give Dharma transmission indiscriminately as a kind of graduate, on a kind of graduate program basis. So, it wasn't always that way in Japan.

[28:40]

But when religion gets big, then you start doing things more automatically. So that's also a kind of difference between here and Japan, is that we don't do that so easily. And I think that's good that we shouldn't give Dharma transmission as a kind of... so easily as they do in Japan. Most of the monks are quite young still when they have Dharma transmission and do Zuisei. They're like old folks. Are there steps after Zuisei? Yeah, there are steps after Zuisei which... We don't feel unnecessary.

[29:48]

And Hoetsu doesn't feel unnecessary. And there are more, you know, steps like that would be the equivalent of bishops and, you know, this kind of stuff, which we're not interested in. So that's one of the controversial things that we have with them, is positions after Zuisei, which we're not particularly interested in. We want to keep it more simple and not so bureaucratic. What exactly is Dharma Transmission? Dharma Transmission, exactly, Well, it's several things.

[30:51]

One way to describe it is when a teacher and student, when the teacher understands completely the teacher's mind, then the teacher can give the student dharma transmission. So it's like pouring water from one vessel into another, but actually there's nothing that's transmitted. So actually it's when you know your own mind, and know your teacher's mind, then you already have dharma transmission. And the ceremony is just an acknowledgement. But also, it's a kind of rank. So people give it out in Japan as a kind of rank. As well as, it should come with understanding.

[31:59]

It should come with understanding. But actually in Japan it means that you're a full priest. Until you have Dharma transmission, you're not fully a priest. I don't know how many temples there are. I can't remember the statistic, but Soto Seikan is the biggest school of Buddhism in Japan, besides the Jodo Shinshu. If there were four of you, would you do it at once? But I was wondering if you were able to do things the same?

[33:06]

maybe we would ask the person to teach, you know, to maybe do Zuisei at Tatsuhara and then teach at a practice period, a little different way. But at Soji-ji, they had four incense stands, five incense stands. And so five people did the service at once, you know. And each one had a kobaku, or an incense stand. And at AHE, we all did it together with one incense stand. It was very interesting. Actually, it was nice that way because it was a more intimate feeling. And then we did part of it at Dogen's the Founders Hall, Dogen's Founders Hall at AHE.

[34:24]

That was quite nice, too. So it was a good experience. It was quite a good experience. They gave us a rehearsal the night before on how to do this, and then in the morning we did the... Yeah, we were kind of stumbling and bumbling around, you know, but... But it was good. The experience was very good. And then they served us these very, very nice meals, you know, which only the Japanese can do. And it's a really very special kind of many dishes, you know, very nicely done. So that was nice. And they treated us well. And at AHAG, we had an English-speaking monk who took care of us. And also at AHAG, the head of the foreign department at AHAG was quite nice.

[35:38]

He spoke English well. He'd lived in the United States for quite a while. He was warning us about standing our ground with the shumucho. So that was quite nice, too. Yes? Sir, the discussion between dialogue between these groups, the different schools, That happens in America. Yeah, only in America. That's the kind of nice thing about America. In Japan that doesn't happen so much. People stay with their group and they don't mingle so much. They even said something like, what if you gave Dharma transmission to somebody and then they

[36:41]

and then they wanted to go study with a Tibetan teacher. He said, oh no, we don't do that. Which we don't. But I said, but, you know, what's wrong with, it's okay to study with a Tibetan teacher as long as you know where you're, where you are, what your practice is. So, they have a different attitude, right? Even Soto and Rinzai people don't mix. They like to keep things separate. You know, if you look at the food, the way the food is served, everything is separate, not mixed up. In America, food is all mixed up. Stew... Stew is not so much their way. Everything has its own place. And if you mix, you do it in a certain way. But in a way, that's kept communication distant.

[37:49]

But in another way, it's preserved certain kinds of, you know, everything has its sides. But in America, we do mix things up more. And we, you know, we respect other traditions. and even study with some other traditions. It's bound to be in America. That's American way. But at the same time, it's good to know what our own roots are of this practice and preserve those. And know what... Before we know what to eliminate, we have to know what it is. So to accept whatever comes, and deal with it, and then if it's to continue, it will. And if certain things will fall by the wayside, and other things will continue, and new things will develop.

[38:55]

So I think it's a good development. It's bound to happen, and you can't ignore it. But I would like to see us, both sides, be benefited by that. The Soto school in Japan, and all Buddhism in Japan, needs rejuvenation. And the foreign students are very valuable to them for rejuvenation. And they know the world is changing and is becoming more cosmopolitan, and they have to do that. And they know that. So... they know that they need us for that as much as we need something from them, too. So it's good, as long as we can keep it on a good level. One thing I wanted to remind you of is the practice period, which is starting next Sunday with one day sitting.

[40:05]

And so I want to, again, I remind you of that and urge you to participate if you can. There are the little sheets outside Zendo where you can decide to what extent it's possible to do the practice period. Because for each one of us it's a little different. The amount of participation is up to you. and you can make some commitment which is compatible with your life and with the activities of your life. And making that, deciding how to make that commitment in itself tells us how to practice in this style of practice. Because in order to really practice this style of practice,

[41:11]

lay practice where you live at home and you have a family or work and so forth and you sit at the zendo practice. You always have to be deciding how you do that because there's no set way. Each one of us has a different, a little different way. So to make a commitment which is compatible with your life and staying with that for six weeks and participating as much as you can is good training in how to make, how to practice in this style of practice. Because we have to do that all the time anyway. So I urge you to join the practice period if you can. Yeah.

[42:15]

Okay. On Tuesday evening, we have a Sagaki ceremony. And Sagaki comes from India. And it's taken up in Japan, of course, as it becomes very important in the spring and the fall. communicating with the deceased spirits and honoring the deceased spirits and identifying with the deceased spirits. It's like Halloween. It's the Eastern equivalent of Halloween. And so we put it together with Halloween. And we make Halloween into a more of a serious kind of business, even though it does have its lighter side.

[43:23]

A swaging or placating the disembodied spirits. And taking care of the desire, strong desire and yearning of All spirits. Hungry ghosts. It's the ceremony of the hungry ghosts, of which we're all hungry ghosts. Sometimes we think of hungry ghosts as the disembodied spirits that can't find any place to settle. And, as you know, we all belong in that group. It's a kind of transparency, you know, it's a kind of like bringing it all together, you know, with identifying ourself with who we really are, disembodied spirits. So, a lot of people put on costumes.

[44:32]

We have this ceremony in the Zindo, and we call all the spirits together, make a lot of noise, and then we have a ceremony for them. And then after that, we have a little Halloween party in the community room. It's actually quite a nice Halloween party. Everybody's dressed up in some way. So please come. Well, yeah, and children come. It's good for kids, but my kid won't be coming because now that he's eight, he just can't turn down the parties at school. Is there anything else?

[45:33]

Okay, thank you.

[45:37]

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