You know, I was looking around to see if Alexandra was here, but she was going to Xerox. She did. So I wanted to include Kaz Tanahashi's translation that he did with, you know, Kaz did recently printed and published the two volumes of Dogen's Shobo Genzo, which he spent the last 25 years translating. And various students helped co-translate with him.

[01:10]

I did. I think I had the most did the most translations with him and started the earliest. And so he did this one, I think, with Catherine Dennis and maybe Michael Winger. So I want to include this translation. I like the translation. It's more straightforward than some. Translating, every translator has a different way of, a different voice when they translate. And so each translation presents something a little different. And comparing translations, I think, is important. We get some idea in our mind with one translation and we really believe in it. And then there's another translation which is a little different.

[02:12]

And then we say, oh, that's wrong. But every translation has its merits. So. And each translator, sometimes the translator will just skip over something in a superficial way that another translator will think is really important. So we get these various views. And last time we used Carl Bielfeld's translation and also Heejin Kim's translation. And we'll continue to use those, but I think tonight we'll focus on Taz's translation. So last time we reviewed the first section.

[03:14]

I think there's five different sections depending on how you like to look at it. So this one is this section last time was on thinking. Today. Today we will focus on the second section. OK. The second section and the third section. about the first section, but if we do, we won't get the whole thing finished in the length of time we have. But if you have a question about last time, you're welcome to bring it forth. You don't have to look for something.

[04:19]

If you had something in your mind, then, you know, that was a question from last time because we finished a little bit before the end. So. But for all practical purposes, we leave it behind. My feeling about study. Is that OK with you? It's not in your eyes. OK. My feeling about study is about a class is the class stimulates us to study. And of course, you know, we learn something in the class. But I think that. We don't always cover everything. And I think for me, having a class is a stimulation to study, not just what we're studying, but to uncover, you know, stimulate you to search out more. Like, you know, I don't know how many people have really studied Dong Yin, you know.

[05:21]

These are not easy fascicles. Not everybody has a good foundation or background of studying Dogen, but I think a lot of us do. And I would hope that it would stimulate you to study more. So I'm going to read and we can talk about the second section. So he talks about now, however careless students in recent times say. I think I read this last time. Actually, I did. So let's start on number three. Yeah. He just talks about, you know, stuff.

[06:25]

Section 3. You got that? Matsuo Zen Master Daiji Zhangzi studied with Nanyue Zen Master Dahui. Okay, so who's who? Dahui, Nanyuan is Nangaku. So Nangaku, that's what we call them in Japanese, Nanue or Nangaku. The sixth ancestor, Daikan Eno, who you're all familiar with, had many disciples, but his two main disciples were Nangaku, Nanue, and Seigen, Kyoshi. Seigen is in our lineage, right? We chant Seigen Gyoshi every day.

[07:30]

We chant the lineage. And Seigen's line, the line coming from Seigen, came down through the Tozan Ryokai. and Sozan, his student, and called the Cao Dong school, which translates into Soto Zen. And Nangaku lineage was transformed by Lin Chi and became the Rinzai school in Japan, in China and Japan. So the Rinzai lineage and the Soto lineage. So the Soto lineage comes through Seigen. Rinzai lineage comes through Nangaku.

[08:31]

So this is Nanyue, who is in Japanese they say Nangaku. Nanyue. And Master Matsu was his disciple. Baso they call him. Japanese, Baso and Matsu. They said he had, Suzuki Roshi used to talk about his long tongue, that he was a big guy and very powerful. He had a tongue, he could reach his nose with his tongue. Or maybe it was his forehead. I'm not sure. His forehead. So anyway, so Matsu the student of Nangaku, Nanyue, Zen Master Daiji Jiangzi, studied with Nanyue, Zen Master Dahui. After intimately receiving Nanyue's mind seal, in other words, his transmission, Matsu was continuously engaged in Zazen.

[09:42]

So one day, Nanyue went up to him and says, virtuous one, what's your intention in doing Zazen? That's a good question for everybody, isn't it? Why are we doing Zazen? So that's what he's going to talk about. Why are we doing Zazen? So quietly pondered his question. Then he gives us some things to ponder about the question. He says, was Nanyue asking if Matsu had the intention of going beyond Zazen? If he had an intention outside of Zazen? Or if he had no intention at all? Was Nanyue asking what kind of intention emerges while doing Zazen? Investigate this thoroughly. We could do that. We might take a few minutes to do that. Koi responded to this question. was Nanyue asking if Matsu had the intention of going beyond Zazen.

[10:49]

Well, what does it mean, going beyond Zazen? Does it mean achieving something else outside of Zazen? I think that's right. Achieving something else besides just Zazen. That's a good answer. If he had an intention outside of Zazen, What would that be like? If using Zazen as a means to an end, be outside of Zazen or beyond Zazen. Yeah, okay, that's good. Or if he had no intention at all. I think that would be hard. It would be pretty hard to say Zazen with no intention at all. puts forth all the questions, whether they're answerable or not.

[11:51]

So, was Nan Yue asking, what kind of intention emerges while doing Zazen? What would that be? What kind of intention emerges? Yeah? Well, maybe when you're sitting there, you kind of you let go of other intentions that you might have because they're not useful for you right then, and you develop an intention that is more useful for you right then? Well, that's a good answer. So this can be investigated more thoroughly, but I think that's good. So then he talks about, he suddenly skips to the dragon. And he says, I know most of you know the story, but you should love a true dragon instead of loving a carved one. So this story is of course the story of, I can't remember the man's name, but in ancient China, who loved dragons.

[13:00]

And so he loved dragons so much he collected all these carvings of dragons and scrolls of dragons And he made his house that kind of looked like a dragon, you know, a dragon house. So, but one day a dragon looked at the house and he said, that guy loves me. So he came out and stuck his head in the house, breathed a little fire. What's his name? Scooted out, never came back. So, Gogen is alluding to this story. He says, quietly ponder this question. Very much. Now, you should love a true dragon instead of loving a carved dragon. OK? But, however, you should know that both carved and true dragons have the ability to produce clouds and rain.

[14:08]

So dragons have the ability to produce clouds and rain. That's one of their characteristics. The dragon in the water and the tiger in the mountain. That's a kind of popular phrase. It's like the tiger finds his home in the mountains and the dragon finds his home in the deep water. Even though the dragon breathes fire. So he's saying this, he's saying you should love a true dragon instead of loving a carved one. Of course, you know, a true dragon is like the real thing, right? And not just a picture or a carving or an idea about what it is. You know, don't get hung up on your idea. Let go of your idea and find the true dragon. So this practice is called searching out the true dragon. But at the same time, Dogen is turning his story to his own, to express his own, what he wants you to understand, that the carved dragon is also important.

[15:23]

Study is also important. Your idea is also important. important for the real thing. You shouldn't abandon the supporting circumstances that allow you to find the real thing. So, study is important, but it's called the second principle. The True Dragon is called the first principle. Study is called the second principle. And one of Bierfeldt's notes say that at that time, when Doberman was writing this, that the carved dragon had been used as an analogy for meditation practice, and the true dragon for enlightenment, as though there was another wrinkle in there.

[16:28]

Well, that's right. So, practice and enlightenment. You could use it in that way. You could use it. simile to mean, as you explained it, the carved dragon is using meditation in order to gain enlightenment. But Cordovieto's prevailing idea then was that the meditation is just only a car dragging, provisional. That's right, provisional. And so he talks about that, yeah. So Dogan is, this is just one of his rants, which he's always, he just keeps bringing this up more and more.

[17:30]

And that's actually the point of this whole thing, is that Zazen, not meditation, but Zazen. Zazen is not a meditation practice. Not one of the meditation practices. 37 meditation practices. 39 meditation practices. It includes all meditation practices. But it goes beyond meditation practices. So he doesn't really equate Zazen as meditation or one of the meditation practices of Buddhism. This is an important point for Dogen. I saw a metaphor for that. Say that again. I saw a metaphor for that. It's like dancing. At first, when people learned how to dance, they were different

[18:35]

clothing, and they do dance, but it's not the dance that they are going to perform, the whole costume and whole of everything, you know, of the performance. So it's kind of dance. It's dance and at the same time practicing, but it's not the final performance, which is dance. The dance, every step of the dance is the final performance. Well, because... Zazen you're talking about. Yeah, we're talking about Zazen, right? So, that's the dance. So every step at some point you will perform the whole dance.

[19:42]

Because the whole dance is being performed in each step. So you don't look for something called the end product. You have to find the end product in the beginning. And if you think of dancing You don't think, let's go out and dance in order to arrive at the final note. You dance to dance. You dance to dance. That's right. I had this woman who was a student who was a tennis player. And her whole philosophy of tennis was to win. But I always keep losing. I'm really good, but I always keep losing.

[20:44]

And I said, well, just play to play. And then you'll win. If you play to play, then you may win or you may not. But if you simply play to play, you're always winning. Because you're not dependent on winning and losing. So did she win? Of course. I'm not sure. I hope so. So, quietly ponder this question. You should love a true dragon instead of loving a carved one. However, you should know that both carved and true dragons have the ability to produce clouds and rain. Do not treasure or belittle what is far away, but be intimate with it. Well, footnote usually says, far away means the tall dragon, and what's near means the carved dragon.

[21:56]

So, I don't want to argue with that, but it could be the other way around. It could be the other way around. So, do not treasure or belittle what is near, but be intimate with it. So in other words, be intimate with both. Don't worry about it. Do not make light or a big deal of what you see with your eyes. Do not make light or a big deal of what you hear with your ears. Rather, illuminate your eyes and ears. I think some translation says, when you see mountains, do you really see the mountain? The ocean, the water, do you really see the water? So don't make a big deal about what you see, because what you see is just what your imagination conjures up.

[23:02]

So Mahatma said, here we get back to the story, Matsu said, my intention is to become a Buddha. Boy, it should have stuck his neck out there. Well, yes. So there's some question about, you know, is this before or after? You know, you think, well, he should know, right? So, but, you know, this is, a little stage play. So I think these stories like this, especially this one, there are many stories like this. In the koans, there are many koans like this, where it's like Punch and Judy, you know, a little puppet play. So it's a setup. It's a setup for Dogen to, although this is a story that precedes Dogen, he's using it as a little play to illustrate his meaning.

[24:13]

So he has Matsu saying, duh, my intention is to become a Buddha. So Dogen says, you should clarify these words. What is the meaning of becoming a Buddha? Does becoming a Buddha mean being made Buddha by another Buddha? Buddha making oneself Buddha? Is this the emergence of one or two Buddhas? Is the intention to become a Buddha dropping off, or is dropping off the intention to become Buddha? Does this mean that however many ways there are to become Buddha, to be immersed in this intention to become a Buddha, is the intention to become Buddha? Well, there's a lot of questions there. Do you want to go through these questions? No. No. But this is kind of rhetoric. So, no, that Matsu meant that Zazen is invariably the intention to become Buddha, and that Zazen is invariably becoming Buddha with intention.

[25:23]

I like using the word intention, which I think is the proper word. Because intention is about Zazen. Karl uses a different word. He says figuring. Figuring, yeah. I don't like figuring. Figuring has that connotation of mental calculation. Yeah, mental calculation. I like intuition. I wonder if figuring is not a Maybe figuring would be sort of like a conscious practicing, exploration.

[26:24]

Yeah, but I like intention. Because he said, no, that Mahatma Tathagata is invariably the intention to become Buddha. So my intention, he's not saying, I'm figuring to become a Buddha. My intention is to become Buddha. That makes sense to me more. So know that bhakti means that zazen is invariably the intention to become Buddha, and that zazen is invariably becoming Buddha with intention. That's what you're doing. Nancy? What's the importance of Dharma transmission? I mean, talk about the question. When he said, my intention is to become Buddha, why would Do not say that after Dharma transmission. And I don't know what Dharma transmission is, by the way. The mind seal. It's like the student and teacher have the same understanding.

[27:28]

The teacher verifies the student's understanding. That's called the mind seal. Putting the stamp on it. OK? Yes, that's good. The question is, if he'd actually had that, why is he saying, my intention is to become a Buddha? When he's asked about Zazen. Does the teacher also sometimes say, my intention is to become a Buddha? Well, he usually says, my intention in Zazen is to sit Zazen. That's to catch. We say, the intention of Zazen is to sit Zazen. It's not to become a Buddha. Have you ever heard that before? Yeah. So here he's saying, well, my intention is to become a Buddha, which is like, hey, I thought you understood. So Dogon is taking... He's turning it around.

[28:37]

Dogon knows this. The purpose of Zazen is to Zazen. But here he's saying, turning it around and saying, you know that Matsu meant that Zazen is invariably the intention to become Buddha. OK? So he's giving us this twist. And that Zazen is invariably becoming Buddha with intention. So are they interchangeable? Buddha, Zazen? Well, what he's saying is, he's denying himself. He's denying what he usually says. And taking the opposite tack. If I say, I will never go to San Francisco, and then I turn around and say, I am now going to San Francisco, isn't that turning it around? So intention is prior to becoming a Buddha.

[29:44]

After becoming a Buddha, intention is the very moment of becoming Buddha. Did I read it right? Okay. What part did I read right? It's prior to becoming a Buddha and after becoming a Buddha. I'm sorry. Intention is the very moment of becoming Buddha. At the bottom of 31, the first word is intention, and then that helps set this together. Intention is prior to becoming a Buddha. And it's after becoming a Buddha. Prior and after. Prior and after becoming a Buddha. Intention is the very moment of becoming Buddha. So, I ask you, how much of becoming Buddha is being immersed in intention. I like the word immersed. I think that's a good translation.

[30:49]

I ask you, how much of becoming Buddha is being immersed in intention? Immersion is always a direct expression of totally becoming Buddha. This immersing brings forth more immersing. Every bit of completely becoming Buddha Do not avoid intention. If you avoid it, you lose your body and you miss your life. When you lose your body and you miss your life, this too is a mercenary intention. You can't lose. You can't lose, that's right. Even if you lose, you can't lose. So, the thing is that in... According to the oneness of things, there's no gain and loss. But in the realm of comparative values, there's gain and loss.

[31:54]

So yes, you can lose in the realm of comparative values, but you don't lose in the realm of virtue. Which means non-differentiation. Non-differentiation, which is the opposite of Differentiation. Comparative values. Differentiation means discrimination, which means comparative values. As soon as you discriminate, you divide. And when you divide, you compare. So we live in a world of comparative values, where everything is divided up. But in the realm of virtue, there's no discrimination. There's no division. It's just one. So one and two.

[32:57]

So Dogen is going to continue to talk about one and two. Zero and one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten. Zero is virtue. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 is value. Values. Comparative values. Virtue in what sense? Something's intrinsic quality which can't be divided. Which doesn't hold up against division. I don't understand this, actually. I like the part that says, do not avoid intention.

[34:04]

If you avoid it, you lose your body and miss your life. That seems true. This, too, is immersion in intention. That's a translation. You can think about it more. So I ask you, how much of becoming Buddha is being immersed in intention? Well, all of it, of course. Immersion is always a direct expression of totally becoming Buddha. Immersion means throw yourself into the house of Buddha. Totally throw yourself into practice, actually. So this immersing brings forth more immersing every bit of completely becoming Buddha.

[35:05]

So it is bits and pieces of intention. That's a familiar phrase for Dogon. Do not avoid intention. If you avoid it, you lose your body and miss your life. When you lose your body and you miss your life, this, too, is immersion in intention. Bill Feltz is very different. Yeah, what did he say? Well, in addition to the figuring part, when he gets to the end there, he says, when we avoid one figuring, we destroy our body and lose our life. when we destroy our body and lose our life, this is the entanglement of one figurine. So that has a totally different meaning. It's not saying that it's a good thing. It's just saying that the figurine one is entangled. Yes. And he talks a bit about entanglement. Entanglement is kato.

[36:09]

Kato is a fascicle of Dogen. Usually it means twining lines. It's like wisteria. You know how wisteria grows and it's all tangled and the lines are all tangled and twisted together. Which usually means being bound. Being bound by entanglements. Karma, usually. But Duggan uses it to mean the opposite. Not the opposite, but he uses it for his own purpose. Meaning, twining lines or entanglement is like the relationship between a teacher and a student. That the teacher and the student are totally entangled with each other. And it can be extended to mean entangled with the dharma or entangled with the practice.

[37:11]

Usually entanglement means caught by friends, but here he was being on the same page, or being together in the same way. Like involved. Involved, yeah. Totally entangled. Totally involved. Yeah. The first phrase that reminds me of the idea that if you decide not to decide, you still have made a choice. That's true, yeah. Sort of idea like if you're, you still have intention if you avoid intention. Some kind of intention, yeah. It could be a good meaning or a bad meaning of entanglement that way. Could be, could be. It's very strange though because those are two different meanings of something, and they don't seem to jive exactly.

[38:29]

Maybe, if Dogen talks about dropping your body and your mind, that's very similar to losing your body or your mind. And maybe at some point, with all your attention becoming Buddha, You've got your body and your mind, you've lost it, and that's a good thing. As a result of all your intention. By avoiding it, you lose your body, and you miss your life. That's a different meaning. You think it's okay, you think that's not related. No, it's a different meaning. I think there he means, you miss your life. You lose an opportunity. You lose a vital opportunity. That's what he's talking about here. Yeah, that's what he's talking about here. You lose a vital opportunity.

[39:30]

Is yin and yang valid? What's that? Is yin and yang valid? Is that where he talks about yin and yang? Yes. Yeah, that's the other... I'm just asking. If those are valid. Oh, yin and yang. Yes. Yin and yang are masculine, feminine. That's in the realm of value. Yes, like teacher and student, they cannot be without each other. There's no meaning coming from that. Yeah, I think yin and yang is one way of... Talking about the balance. The synchronicity and balance, right? Twining vines is another way of talking about it. But yeah, I think you could talk about it as yin and yang. He does talk about that here.

[40:33]

He mentions it. You know, here he's also at duality. Well, he goes back and forth between duality and non-duality. Because although we say non-duality, I think duality is always included. As a matter of fact, this whole thing is about duality and non-duality, which we'll get to. Yeah, it seems like he's constantly playing with, when he's in the realm of values, like this last piece we were talking about, he'll say something very clear and strong, and then he won't let you have it. You can't cling to that. Yeah, right, right. But on the other hand, this other part that we were reading earlier about all these questions, you just clarified his words. And then he just kind of goes berserk in clarifying the words. I mean, it's like his mind is just sort of unbridled.

[41:34]

Well, that's right. But I think it's an encouragement to think that way. We have to answer these questions. Well, the thing is that he opens your mind up. He says, no matter how you're thinking, boom. It's not, you know, it's always beyond what you're thinking. And it's always something, some other way of looking at things, besides the way you're thinking, the way you're usually. So, what he's doing is, in one sense, totally throwing a monkey wrench into all our conditioned way of thinking, and our partiality, and our, you know, not looking closely enough and not looking expansively enough. So is it time for one minute to relax? I really like this last idea about what he's talking about with losing your body and losing your life.

[42:47]

This, too, is immersion in intention. How about he's saying that you're always having an intention. It can be a positive one, like being Buddha, or a negative one, like avoiding the intention to be Buddha. And then you get what you get for that. This, too, is immersion in intention, losing your body and your life. That's also a result of a different intention, a different sort of intention. Just put me in, put me in tension. I've been in all these places until you weren't. That's too linear? Too logical? Yeah.

[43:52]

Well, it's not. He said, I mean, I haven't. You don't have to. Yeah. Well, you do. I haven't read that. Yeah. You know, as we translate. Yeah. It came out a little book. You know, sometimes I'd like to look at it and get a sense of what you're looking at. Yeah. Yeah. In the back. Please don't leave. It's time to sit down again. It's not annotated. It's not something annotated. But this he puts in. Yeah. OK. I can do that.

[44:55]

But you don't have to bring it here. I could just sometime in your house. OK. So there are many little points, you know, that drink that we have questions about. But if we take too much time, little points will never get big points. So let's leave that behind. So I'm just going to read that paragraph and go on. So I ask you, how much of becoming Buddha is being immersed in intention?

[46:04]

Immersion is always a direct expression of totally becoming Buddha. This immersing brings forth more immersing. Every bit of completely becoming Buddha. It is bits and pieces of intention. Do not avoid intention. If you avoid it, you lose your body and you miss your life. When you lose your body and you miss your life, this too is immersion, inattention. So, never mind. Now, in a way, he picked up a tile and started to polish it as a rock. So, this is part of the play, right? Now, he picks up a tile and starts polishing it on a rock, rubbing it against the rock. And Masa says, what are you doing? Indeed, who does not see this as polishing a tile? Who can see this as polishing a tile? So Matsu asked, what are you doing?

[47:05]

What are you doing as polishing a tile? Whether in this world or in another world, polishing a tile has never ceased. Thus, you should not regard your view as the only view. In any activity there is always this question. Those who see Buddha without knowing and understanding Buddha, see water without understanding water, and see mountains without knowing mountains. To hastily conclude that what's happening in front of you is a dead end is not a study of Buddha. So it's interesting, those who see Buddha without knowing and understanding Buddha, see water without understanding water, and see mountains without knowing mountains. So, we see Buddha all the time in front of us, but we don't know this is Buddha.

[48:12]

I keep saying, Buddha is right in front of our face. Buddha is in our face all the time, but we don't recognize it. Buddha is the most common thing that we ever experience. Where's Buddha? It's called sometimes filling water by the river, or standing in the middle of the river and saying, where's the water? So Nagarjuna said, I am polishing this tile in order to make a mirror? That's an answer. Clarify these words. Polishing a tile to make a mirror has a deep meaning. It is not a false statement, but is actualizing of a fundamental point. Although a tile is a tile and a mirror is a mirror, there are many ways to investigate the meaning of polishing.

[49:18]

Even an ancient bright mirror comes from polishing a tile. Without knowing that all mirrors come from polishing tiles, you will not understand the words, mouth, or breath of Buddha ancestors." So, the usual meaning of this statement is, or the usual way that we think about this is, of course, how can polishing a tile You can polish a tile forever and wear it out before it becomes a mirror, right? But a dogen is turning it around. Polishing a tile becomes a mirror. Even though polishing a tile is simply polishing a tile. When you polish a tile, a tile becomes a tile. But we don't polish the tile.

[50:21]

Or polishing, cleaning is another word. Cleaning comes before polishing, right? First you clean and then you polish. So if you think of it as cleaning, Dogen says, you don't polish the tile in order to make it clean. A tile is like clay, right? mud, so you don't polish it too. Maybe you think, well, you polish it something to make it clean. Suzuki Roshi, this was the basis of Suzuki Roshi's teaching. He said, every Saturday we would clean the temple at Sokoji in San Francisco. And he'd say, yes, wash the windows and clean the floor, but we don't wash the windows to make them clean.

[51:24]

We wash the windows to wash the windows. When you wash a window, a window becomes a window, and you become you. When you sweep the floor, the floor is just being swept. We don't sweep the floor because it's dirty. We just sweep the floor to sweep the floor. And when we sweep the floor, the floor becomes the floor. Sweeping becomes sweeping, and you become you. This is the secret of practice. A mirror becomes a mirror. A tile becomes a mirror. Everything becomes a mirror. So the whole thing about mirrors, this whole thing about mirrors opens up about mirrors. What is a mirror? I'm getting ahead of myself, but I will say this.

[52:25]

It's preparation for studying what is a mirror. Does mirror refer to enlightenment here? Well, mirror, I'll talk about that. I mean, I won't say yes, but I won't say no. Because if I say yes, then that gives you a definition. Right? That means enlightenment. I mean, it's a metaphor. Yeah, I don't want to give it a definition. I don't want to give mirror a definition as enlightenment, because mirror is mirror. If I say mirror is enlightenment, that means that mirror stops at enlightenment. Enlightenment is included in mirror. Everything is included in mirror. When enlightenment comes, Enlightenment is seen as enlightenment.

[53:28]

When a Chinese person walks in front of the mirror, the mirror sees a Chinese person without partiality. So a mirror has the characteristic of clearly seeing, clearly reflecting. But it does reflect. The mirror just reflects the light. So if it's just absolute darkness, there isn't any reflection. That's why it's kind of enlightened. Enlightened. And darkened. Yes. But we're getting ahead of ourselves. So, nonetheless then, I am polishing this tile to make a mirror. Clarify these words. Polishing a tile to make a mirror has a deep meaning.

[54:33]

It is not a false statement, but it is actualizing of the fundamental point. Although a tile is a tile and a mirror is a mirror, there are many ways to investigate the meaning of polishing. Even an ancient bright mirror comes from polishing a tile. Without knowing that all mirrors come from polishing tiles, you will not understand the words, mouth, or breath of the Buddha ancestors. I'm just going to go on. Matsu said, how do you make a mirror by polishing a tile? Indeed, an iron-willed practitioner, by polishing a tile and doing nothing else, does not make a mirror. Even if making a mirror is not polishing a tile, a mirror is immediately there. So, that's an interesting statement because it seems kind of victory.

[55:36]

Matsu said, how do you make a mirror by polishing a tile? How can you make one thing into another? You can't. Indeed, an iron-willed practitioner by polishing a tile and doing nothing else. Doing nothing else means totally doing. It sounds to me like he's really implying that a mirror will appear if you polish the tile. Is it not saying that? Let's continue. I'm not saying it's not. I'm just saying let's continue. Indeed, an iron-willed practitioner, by polishing a tile and doing nothing else, does not make a mirror.

[56:43]

Even if making a mirror is not polishing a tile, a mirror is immediately there. Sounds like what you're saying. It's not that... well... too many... let's see what he continues on. So Nadenre said, how can you become a Buddha by doing Zazen? So that's the point. The point is, how can you become a Buddha by doing Zazen? be clear that Zazen is not working toward becoming a Buddha. The teaching that becoming a Buddha has nothing to do with Zazen is evident in that sense. So the mirror is always there. The mirror is always there. Whether you polish or don't polish. Whether you polish or don't polish. That's right. Whether you polish or don't polish, the mirror is always there.

[57:47]

So there is a classical doctrine. There's a classical dogon which is called Kokyo. Kokyo means eternal mirror, or the ancient mirror, the timeless mirror, which is a kind of companion piece to this Zazen Shin, because he talks about the same He kind of talked more about his understanding of mirrors, and it reflects, no pun intended, it reflects on this classical zazen shin. Yeah? So the paragraph where it says, we pronounce it non-wei, said, I am polishing this tile to make a mirror. The part that says, clarify these words, is that Dogen speaking?

[58:52]

Yeah, that's Dogen. This koan is about, Nan Wei comes up to Matsu. Matsu is sitting meditation. He's sitting meditation and all of a sudden Nan Wei starts scraping this tile. And after a while Matsu gets impatient. He says, what are you doing? And Nan Wei says, I'm polishing this tile. No, Nan Wei says, what are you doing? And he says, I'm going to become Buddha. No, he says, what are you doing? He says, I'm doing Zazen. Right, to become Buddha. And then Nan Wei starts polishing the tile. And he says, what are you doing? And he says, I'm polishing this tile to make a mirror. That was Nan Wei's way. When he answers, Nan Wei answers, this is not about a tile becoming a mirror. It is completely him showing him that that is no way to become a Buddha. He's being sarcastic in that moment.

[59:53]

In a way, he's hitting his mind. So when he is scraping the tile, it's not about a tile becoming a mirror at all. It's him saying, Matsu says to him, there's no way you're going to make a mirror out of that tile. And he says, well, there's no way you're going to make a Buddha out of sitting Zazen. But the thing is, it's not about any tile becoming a mirror. Well, let's see. That's Dovin turning that classic story of sound in. That's not what it's about, though. The teacher is actually hitting his mind from the position of saying, there's no way to make a tile into a mirror. That's the story. Are you willing to listen? Well, it's also, you know, I mean, this is not... Are you willing to listen? I can listen, but it's not what the story is about. Well, then you're not willing to listen. Well, I can listen. It doesn't mean I can't listen. It's just that that's not what the story is about. Well, there's a whole story here about that.

[60:56]

There's a whole story about that. We all understand what you just said. It's not that we don't understand what you just said. All of us understand exactly what you said, which is correct. But Dogen turns it into different ways to understand. that a mirror and a tile, a mirror is a mirror, a tile is a tile, a tile is a mirror and a mirror is a tile. You have to understand that and you have to have patience to let it unfold. It seems like a woman thinks a lot. No. Well, you can study somebody else. There's studies of other than teachers. Yeah. The H.A. Kim translation of that paragraph seems a little clear. Yeah. Yeah. To me, it says. Being truly an iron-willed person of tile polishing, one does not seek the help of others, yet tile polishing is not mirror-making.

[62:18]

Although mirror-making is nothing but mirror-making, tile polishing itself is instantaneous mirror-making. Isn't this a play on the point we had before about intention? When the intention of sweeping the floor is sweeping the floor, you become more who you are. Where if your intention is to clean the floor, in this case turn the tile into a mirror, you will never get there. But if your intention is to be polishing the tile. That's right. So if you're polishing the floor, if you're sweeping the floor, the floor becomes a mirror. The floor is always a mirror. Everything around you is a mirror. Everything you see and experience is a mirror. Potentially, but not practically.

[63:22]

Well, you just don't see it that way. You don't see it that way. on Master Tungshan crossing a stream. This is Master Tungshan's enlightenment experience. When he stepped into the stream and he saw his reflection in the stream, his mind totally opened up. But what does it mean to see a reflection in the stream? You cross the stream, do you ever see your reflection in the stream? No, of course not. That's not the point. The point is, what did he see when he saw himself, his reflection? His nose? I think you're wanting me to say that he saw the stream.

[64:24]

The stream was him. But that's just a guess. Well, that's kind of a small He saw himself as the whole universe. True self is the whole universe. I once saw my reflection in a door and I was shocked. I wasn't aware. I don't know how to explain it, but it was a shock. It was like there was no me. What did you see when you say, I saw myself? I saw a reflection of this, whoever. Well, if you looked at a tile, could you see a reflection? I could. Well, you could or you would.

[65:26]

The point is, if you look at a tile, tiles are not mirrors, are they? I mean, they're dull, you know. I remember when I'd go to the museum, and the ancient mirrors from Egypt, you know, and they were all, they were made of bronze, and they all looked like a tile. And I thought, that's a mirror? How come they're telling me that's a mirror? That's when I was a little kid. I didn't realize that they polished them and then you can see the reflection of your face. You're not necessarily seeing your reflection, you're just simply seeing the reflection of your face. Do you think that's the same? When you see the reflection of your face, are you really seeing your true reflection? you're only seeing the reflection of a face. But if you look at a tile, you don't see the reflection of your face, so you're not fooled.

[66:46]

You could look at a stone, but it's not the reflection of a face, but it reminds you, It triggers a sense of being or a connection. You're getting little by little close. I mean, anything could do that. Yes. Well, yes. Anything does do that. Everything does that. That's the function of everything, is to be a mirror for But it's much more... it keeps unfolding more and more.

[67:50]

So, um... So Matsya says, So, Master says, and how is this so? These words may seem to be asking one thing, but in fact they're asking another. It's like close friends meeting each other, intimate with the other. How so addresses both Zazen and becoming a Buddha at the Shade Time. Dogen is making positive use, in other words, in order not to fall into one aspect or the other, he's using, he's bringing together

[69:14]

becoming a Buddha and Zazen, but so as to not make a gap between Buddha and Zazen. So last time I talked about Daitsu Chisho Buddha. This koan, Daitsu Chisho Buddha, in Zazen without becoming a Buddha. And the question is, well, if he sat so long in Zazen, how come he didn't become a Buddha? Because you can't become something that you already are. So, becoming, but he still uses becoming. He still uses these terms in order to use them in a non-dualistic way.

[70:20]

Usually the story has a dualistic meaning, but he's using it in a non-dualistic way. Using a story that has a dualistic meaning to express the non-duality of practice and enlightenment, basically. So then he talks about the cart and the horse. How much time do we have? 14 minutes. OK. So then he launches into another simile, the cart and the horse. Simile of the cart and the horse. So Nangaku, Nanyue, Nanyue starts talking to him some more. And he says, here's an example. When driving a cart, if it stops moving, do you lift the cart or the ox? Of course, usually, you know, if you're driving a cart and you've got an ox, the cart stops, you know, like if it's a mule, you know, they really, really hard to keep going, but an ox, you know, is also stubborn.

[71:36]

So, when do you hit the cart or the ox? Well, of course you, let's see, In regard to driving a cart, what is moving and what is stopping? Does it mean that water flowing is the cart moving, and water not flowing is the cart moving? You can also say that flowing is water not moving. There is a time when water is moving is not flowing. Thus, when you investigate the cart not moving, there is stopping It depends on time. The word stopping does not merely mean not moving. Well, there is one way of looking at this, which is fairly obvious. When we look at the stream, or a river from high up, from the top of the mountain, the shape of the stream seems to stay the same. But we know that the water is moving.

[72:38]

So is the stream There's this statement, the water stands still while the bridge is moving. We usually see things in one way. We see things from our point of view, from our individual partiality, partial point of view itself. But it's also possible to see the bridges moving and the water standing still. But we see such things from a certain point of view. But here he's saying, does it mean that water is flowing, water flowing is the cart moving, and water not flowing is the cart moving.

[73:43]

You can also say that flowing is water not moving. There is a time when water is moving is not flowing. Thus we investigate the cart. Not moving. There is stopping and no stopping. Depends on time. The word stopping does not merely mean not moving. So let's see what he says and see if that will help to clarify what he's saying. So in regard to non-UA's words, do you whip the cart or the horse or the ox? Is it that you sometimes hit the cart and sometimes hit the ox? Is hitting the cart the same as hitting the ox or not the same? In the secular world there is no custom of hitting the cart. Of course not. Although there is no common custom of hitting the cart, in the Buddha way there is the practice of hitting the cart.

[74:54]

This is the eye of study. Even if you realize the practice of hitting the cart, it is not the same as hitting the ox. So study this thoroughly. So although hitting the ox is commonly practiced. You should investigate hitting the ox in the Buddha way. Is it hitting a living buffalo? An iron ox? Or a day ox? Those are like koans. Is it hitting with a whip? With the entire world? Or with the whole mind? Is it hitting the marrow? Hitting with the fist? How about the fist hitting fist and ox hitting ox? So he's presenting all these different ways of looking at something. in order to clear your mind so that you can realize that hitting the cart is the same as hitting the ox. So what he's talking about is Zazen. This is all about Zazen.

[75:56]

Because the ox and the cart are one piece. Practice and enlightenment, practice and realization are one piece. That's what he's saying. So, in Buddhism there's Samatha and Vipassana. Vipassana is the mind and Samatha is the body. Samatha is like Samadhi. Vipassana is like The Sixth Ancestor in the Platform Sutra says Samadhi and Prajna are inseparable.

[77:08]

In the history of Buddhism, the way of the mind and the way of the body Samatha and Vipassana have customarily been separated. And so, they're amongst the body and amongst the mind, so to speak. But Sanatana is not body and mind separate, but body and mind as one thing. And in the Platform Sutra, someone asks Huineng about Samadhi and Prajna. And he says, Samadhi is like the lamp and its light. Samadhi is like the lamp and Prajna is like the light. So you can't have one without the other. If you have Samatha, Samadhi, then Prajna is always there. And in order to have Prajna always there, you need Samadhi as the base.

[78:12]

So Samadhi is like Zazen. It's like sitting. It's meditation. And for lack of a better word, prajna is wisdom. So samadhi is the basis of wisdom. So when we sit in sadhana, enlightenment is there. Whether we have realization or not is another matter. understanding of practice is samadhi and enlightenment arise together. One minute of practice is one minute of enlightenment. The card and the horse.

[79:17]

The card is like samatha and the horse is like vipassana. The card is like samadhi or sitting and the horse or the axe is like realization or enlightenment. It doesn't matter where you hit. Usually the head leads, right? But in our practice, the body leads. You don't have to understand what you're doing mentally. When we sit in Zazen, we think we understand. There are things to understand. We can understand that you sit this way across your legs or however you do it, you know, and so forth.

[80:18]

And we think, well, I understand it. But we understand something, but we don't understand it all completely. It's beyond our understanding. We experience this that is beyond our understanding, but we don't understand it completely. But we know that So intuition, that's why intuition is so important because it's beyond either, it's beyond anything. So yes, we whip the cart and we whip the horse. It doesn't matter where you whip it. It doesn't matter where you, you know. The head is leading. Sometimes the horse is leading. And sometimes the body is leading. When you put your body into the position, it orients your mind. And your mind orients your body.

[81:20]

And when they work perfectly together, that's wonderful. Sometimes you drag your body, and then you sit, and your mind becomes one with your body. So, they're not separate. It's what you call a unifying principle. So, although hitting the ox is commonly practiced, you should investigate hitting the ox in the Buddha way. It is hitting a living buffalo. He comes up and talks about all that. And then Matsu was silent. Do not ignore this silence. This is hurling a tile to attract a jewel, turning the head and turning the face. This silence cannot be taken away." So Matsu had nothing to say, but Matsu was just totally present.

[82:27]

So Nagiwaya then instructed Investigate this statement and understand the pivotal point of the ancestral school. Those who missed the essential meaning of the practice of sitting Zen may say that it is the practice of sitting Buddha. But how can those who are not authentic descendants be sure that the practice of sitting Zazen is the practice of sitting Buddha? Know that the Zazen of a beginner's mind is the beginning of Zazen. The beginning of Zazen is the beginning of sitting Buddha. So that's why, you know, Yukiro, she understood this very well. That's why he called that practice Beginner's Mind. Which means, not knowing mind, mind that is beyond knowing and not knowing.

[83:30]

thinking of thinking, non-thinking, beyond thinking and non-thinking. I want to go back to the very beginning of the opening, where the very first, the opening page. That's one of the disappointments of the beginning, the very beginning. So Yaoshan, great master Hongdao, was sitting. The monk asked him, instead of just sitting, what do you think? Yaoshan said, think not thinking. How do you think not thinking? And Yaoshan replied, beyond thinking and not thinking, which is Which means beyond thinking and not thinking.

[84:51]

So I just wanted to see how that is reflected here. Which is beginning mind, basically. Beyond thinking and not thinking. It's like not knowing mind. Don't know mind. That's the thing Sun used to say. Don't know mind. Just go and don't look behind. Just keep going. Not knowing mind. Don't know mind. And Suzuki Goshi used that too. Then this is page 34.

[85:58]

I turned the page and it's time to stop. So maybe that's a good place to stop. I want to continue. next time. I also have some commentary by Suzuki Roshi, which I'll bring forth next time, based on this particular translation. It's not based on this translation, Somebody put together this part of using this translation and Suzuki Roshi's comment.

[87:05]

This translation was done after he died. I recommend, if you have an opportunity, I can't Xerox everything. It would be too costly and too much. But I would suggest that you find a translation of Kokyo, K-O-K-Y-O, which is the companion piece to this, where Dogen talks about mirror, what is the ancient mirror. And he also mentions this story in that fascicle. Well, Judy pointed out that just Abby has also been so online.

[88:12]

So anybody can just look that up. She asked Abby. She'll go again. So you can find it. Yes, you can find it faster. That's cool. Yeah. Good. Thank you. Because it's translated that. Oh, yeah. That's one of those collections. Two volumes had just been published. I don't know why... I think we have them in the bookstore. We should though. Yeah, but we have those earlier collections. We have earlier, yeah. The Moon and the New Dragon and so on. And I think it might be in one of those. I don't remember it in one of those, but... Yeah, this is it. It sounds familiar. Cass' two volume set is $92 on Amazon. But yeah, monumental work. It is. That's $50 cheaper than the bookstore.

[89:20]

Look it up on Amazon.

[89:22]

@Text_v004
@Score_JJ