Well, in the last few days, there's been a big change in the fact that a war has already begun. So, how does that affect everyone's attitude? That's a good question. And before the war, there was a lot of protest. I don't think anyone ever thought that protest would change the fact that there was going to be a war. I have been very naive to think that that would happen. And so people would think, well, a lot of people, what's the use, you know, if it's not going to change anything, if it's not going to change the fact that there will be a war.

[01:18]

But that's not the reason why people protest. That's just short term. That's just one little dot on the big map. In the long run, this kind of, this effort by people who want to bring peace to the world is an ongoing effort. And when this kind of effort to create instability and war and avarice sticks up its head in a prominent way, then the people who want peace show their faces.

[02:22]

And so it looks like there's an effort to do something to stop this particular incident. That's not untrue, but that's not what it's about. It's about continuously making an effort to bring peace into the world, whether there's a war going on or not going on. So the effort is the same, it doesn't change with the circumstances. I think that's something that is very important to remember. So, since this war has started, it's a new phase and there needs to be some adjustment made in how people approach this. So I want to give some time to listen to what people might have to say.

[03:25]

So I thought I would talk about our current event in terms of as a Buddhist or as anyone with conscience how do we actually save the world? How do we save society? Our four vows, you know, as a Buddhist are to save society and everyone and the world from suffering and confusion. There's lots of suffering and lots of confusion. And if we keep that in mind, it's not so much targeting people, certain people, but how do we preserve that within ourselves?

[04:40]

how do we actually bring peace and nonviolence into the world? Where it's so easy to focus on the faults of others, and others are at fault. But how do we focus on ourselves? How can we actually bring something positive into the world. And the more we focus on doing that, the more we see that there are others all around the world who are doing the same. So right now, there's a huge groundswell of dissent The only thing that keeps us in this war is our own powerful war machine and the will to continue to dominate and a lot of money.

[05:53]

So I want to talk about it using the Buddhist Wheel of Life. If you're familiar with the Buddhist Wheel of Life, it is a circle with a 12-fold chain of causation around the perimeter. And inside that is the six worlds. And inside that is a little hub. And the whole thing turns on this little hub. And the little hub is the pig, the chicken, and the what? The serpent. Yeah, the pig, the chicken, and the serpent. which stands for greed, ill-will and delusion.

[06:58]

So the whole business revolves, the whole wheel revolves around greed, ill-will and delusion. So how do we introduce something different? How do we introduce a different hub so that And the wheel turns on generosity, goodwill, and enlightenment. So, what we need is a regime change. So in the six worlds, you know, we have at the top the heavenly realm, and at the bottom the hell realm, and then there's the fighting demon realm, and then there's the animal realm, and there's the human realm, and the hungry ghost realm, the pretas.

[08:13]

In the A heavenly realm, that's usually called the realm of the gods, you know, who have a wonderful, comfortable time. But in human terms, it's the realm where people have everything they want, or everything that they think they want. and they don't have to worry, they don't have to work, they don't have to mingle with poor people or even pay attention to the fact that there is misery in the world. This is kind of where Shakyamuni was when he was growing up. His father wanted to keep him from having any contact with the suffering of the world. So he created a kind of heavenly realm where Siddhartha was just playing all day long.

[09:24]

He had everything that his father wanted him to have, but he became very dissatisfied with it at some point. That was the beginning of his enlightenment experience, which was culminated after his hard practice. So, in the heavenly realm, it looks like you'll be there forever, but it doesn't last. Your karma brings you to this point, but it also, when the karmic effect is no longer working, then you descend into some other realm. Then there's the fighting demon realm. The fighting demon realm, the asuras, are those whose satisfaction is in creating disturbance and chaos and war, the warriors, the warrior types.

[10:33]

Right now, the warrior type is in the ascendancy, very prominent. Those people in the heavenly realm, well let me just explain, in each one of these realms is a Bodhisattva. So what is the place of the Bodhisattva in each one of these realms? The place of the Bodhisattva in each one of these realms is to educate people, to enlighten people, to make them aware of nirvana, of cooling it, cooling off. That's the role of the Bodhisattva in each one of these worlds. And as a Bodhisattva, as a Zen student, you find yourself in these worlds, in these realms.

[11:42]

And so what will you do about that? How do you find yourself as a Bodhisattva in these worlds? How do you find yourself as a Bodhisattva within the heavenly realm? How do you find yourself as a bodhisattva within the fighting demon realm, which is where our attention is at the moment? Which means, what do you do about that? What can you do? In the heavenly realm, the bodhisattva teaches meditation. which seems to be the easiest way for the people in the heavenly realm to find their Buddha nature. In the fighting demon realm, it's morality or the precepts.

[12:44]

The Bodhisattva teaches precepts. Don't kill. don't take what's not given and so forth. I was listening to an interview on TV yesterday and of course you know the TV, every TV station has the war on and so the interviewer was interviewing some pilots And the interviewer was asking, what do you think about when you're up there, you know, dropping bombs on people? He didn't say that, actually. He said, that's what he meant. But he said, what was it like up there, you know, in this fantastic firestorm.

[13:51]

How did you feel about it? And he said, well, it was a great experience. I'll never forget this experience. And he was kind of referring to all the fireworks. And then the interviewer was saying, well, but what do you feel about it? And he kept avoiding the subject of what he felt about it. And then, for one moment, the interviewer said, well, what do you really feel about it? And then he paused for a moment as if he got it. And then he went on, well, it was an experience I'll never forget, blah, blah, blah. But it's like a video game for the pilots. It's like a video game. And to actually allow yourself to think that there are people down here that you're killing is not something that you do.

[14:53]

And there was another pilot being interviewed, and that's kind of what he said. He said, well, you know, it's so quiet, and you drop the bomb, and it's almost, you know, everything is so smooth, and then you're away before Even the bomb drops, so you don't even see the effect of what you did. dropping that bomb." And he says, well, he couldn't answer, you know. If you really are in that position and you think about what you're really doing, what the effect of what you're doing is, it's pretty hard to do that. So, I mean, he's a wonderful young man, you know, intelligent, crafty, knowing what they're doing, you know, the cream of the crop, you know, but they're not, they're not really, they're deprogrammed to think about what they're actually doing in the end.

[16:14]

And if you think about what's going on, we get further and further away from the effect of our actions in war. And so, I was wondering, you know, I hear Rumsfeld and so forth, and the president saying, well, I feel so sorry for those Marines that were killed, you know, and their families, and I'm going to write a letter to each one. But I thought, well, why not write a letter to each one of the Iraqi families for feeling, for apologizing for killing their relatives? That would be a great act of nobility. And morality, actually.

[17:25]

War is actually an immoral act in itself. And there's some question, you know, whether now there's actually some question and debate in the world about whether or not war should just be outlawed. So this brings up this whole preemptive war, brings up the question of among the nations, whether or not to really outlaw war. But when someone is so powerful, when a country is so powerful and does their will, hard to deal with it. But the whole world has to deal with that, which is good.

[18:30]

Things are happening on both sides. The fighting demons have to be converted by paying attention to precepts and morality. Don't steal. Don't take something that's not given. Don't lie. I mean, don't lie. Lying is at the basis of the whole thing. We did not... Going to war is the last thing we want to do.

[19:32]

Well, that's the biggest lie of all. So then we get down to the world of the animal world, the animal realm, which is a human realm, but it's like our animal nature, it's like instinct. And when people in the animal realm kind of scarf up a lot of food and snort, you know, like pigs, and just pay attention to their instincts. And they don't really have much learning. And they're not interested in learning anything. And they just kind of live off the fat of the land. And there's a lot of people in the animal realm in our country.

[20:41]

That's hard to deal with. The Bodhisattva in the animal realm teaches people prajnaparamita, the perfection of wisdom, which is what they lack. Teaches them that form is emptiness and emptiness is form. The hell realm, of course, is a realm of our own making. Heaven and hell are the two opposites. The heavenly realm where everything is just beautiful and wonderful for a while, and the hell realm where nothing works and we're punished for our transgressions.

[21:50]

for our ignorance and our ill will and our greed. And we can make this world a world of hell or whatever we want it to be. But heaven and hell are strictly earthly realms. Right now, we're making it hell for a lot of people. Then there's the hungry ghost realm. This is the realm of greed, where we can never have enough. I feel very sorry for our industrialists and our administration because they are mired in poverty.

[22:57]

The wealthiest people are mired in poverty because they can never have enough. This is the definition of poverty. You just don't have enough. I know somebody who has three robes and a bowl, and they're perfectly content. And they're very wealthy. These are the wealthy people. But the people who can never have enough are the poor people. And so, in a way, I feel sorry for them. But since they're driven by avarice, they don't realize how they're hooked. You really get hooked. The craving for wealth, the craving for power, the craving for recognition, all of these cravings

[24:14]

are captivating and people can't get out of it. Especially the craving for power is the most captivating and hardest to let go of. So the Bodhisattva in this realm It has to teach letting go, how to have, how to be satisfied. One of the factors of enlightenment is, of an enlightened person is how they can be satisfied, easily satisfied. So we keep pushing the envelope, you know, pushing the envelope and pushing the envelope so that whenever we make some advancement in the standard of living, so-called, we have to keep upping the ante of the standard of living and then we have to keep

[25:47]

stealing more and more from the world, from the rest of the world, in order to support our habit of upping the standard of living. We have the poorest standard of living in the world, but we think it's the highest. The reason it's the poorest is because it needs to feed itself by draining the rest of the world. So this keeps driving the desire for more, which keeps driving the wheel of domination, which drives the wheel of war. So we have to look at ourselves, how much do I need? That's the bottom line. We're all hungry ghosts.

[26:51]

big tummies with a great demand for more and little teeny throats. We can't get enough. So as the world becomes more complex and We need to have more information. We need to have more conveniences. We need to have bigger cars. We need to have all these things. You know, I was making a sandwich the other day, and I realized that in order to make a sandwich, I had to go to this big box that keeps things cold. take out the bread, which is wrapped up in a bag, which has a thing on it, and then take some mustard out of the refrigerator, and then take something out of the freezer, and then get an onion, and then get a tomato, and then get some lettuce, and then, you know, on and on and on and on, you know, just to make this little thing that you're gonna eat.

[28:19]

And then to think about how much energy went into creating those things and bringing those things to this place. So I could do this little act and then have a little sandwich to eat. But that's just one example. If you go into your garage, if you have one, what's in there? Think about it. So, we just have, it just keeps coming, you know, coming and coming. It's just the conveyor belt of stuff that we think we need, but actually we don't need it. But it drives the engine, drives the economy. The economy is built in such a way, developed in such a way that if that's not happening, the whole thing starts coming apart.

[29:23]

So, as a bodhisattva, how do we just deal with our own greed, much less dealing with the greed of the world around us? It has to start here, letting go of our greed and our necessities, and what we think is our necessity. And then there's the world of human beings, the human world. And the human world is the world that's caught up in greed, hate and delusion. All of these worlds coalesce in the human being. They are the human world. But the human world is really the world of salvation.

[30:34]

And it's the highest. So, you know, people say, well, what does it mean to be a Buddha? What does it mean, you know, what is the end of practice? What is the goal of practice? The goal of practice is just to be a real human being. A true human being. Able to deal with greed. able to deal with ill-will, able to deal with delusion. I don't want to say free of. Nobody's free of it. Greed is something that we'll always be dealing with. We might say, well, at some point, you know, like, when I'm enlightened, I'll no longer feel greed, or I'll no longer feel ill-will, or I'll no longer feel delusion. That's not it. When you're enlightened, you realize, I'm really greedy.

[31:39]

I understand my greed. I understand what causes my greed. I understand how I relate to it. And I'm always aware. I understand my ill will. It's not that I don't have it, but I make some effort to deal with it and not let it get out of hand. and turn it so that it's not harmful. And I realized how deluded I am. To be enlightened means to understand and realize your own delusion. Not that I will never be deluded because I'm enlightened, but because I'm enlightened, I understand that I will always be deluded. I will always have delusion. If you think, I have no delusion, then you're not enlightened. That's really being sunk deeply in delusion.

[32:44]

So, how do we work with greed, ill will and delusion? That's the point. And when we work on our own greed, ill will and delusion, then it helps other people. It helps the people around us because it influences other people to do the same. So bringing peace to the world is not an easy thing. It means always working on yourself. And that's practice. And how do you save all sentient beings? Well, start with this one. That's all you have to do. Just start with this one. To actually work on the sentient beings of your own mind is how you save all sentient beings. So those are the six worlds and we're constantly transmigrating from one to the other.

[34:05]

Sometimes we're a fighting demon. Sometimes we're a hungry ghost. Sometimes we're in the hell realm. Sometimes we're in the heavenly realm. But we go every day from one to the other. And to know, oh, now I'm in the hungry ghost realm. Or now I'm in the fighting demon realm. How do I just become a human being, a normal human being? Normal is something we don't really experience very often. We think normal is just what I'm always doing. Buddha said, It's reported to have said, just all I teach is the norm.

[35:13]

Yes, my whole teaching is just the norm. But the norm is elusive. So, you know, the human race is evolving. from my point of view, the human race, in my opinion, the human race is evolving, and there are people who are very evolved as humans, and there are people who are not very evolved as humans, and then there's the whole range in between. So I think we have to be very compassionate with people and realize that, and not necessarily think, I'm highly evolved. And they're not. But there has to be some education. So we should be careful to help people to come up to where we are.

[36:31]

and then reach up so that someone can help us to go beyond who we are. So we have to have lots of patience. Lots of patience. And even though it looks like the world's coming apart, to have patience is the greatest virtue. With all of the stuff that's going on, to have patience is the greatest virtue. To deal with what you can deal with the best you can, and that which you can't do much about, to have patience. So, Would you like to? Yeah, Ann? Did you say what the Bodhisattva in the hell realm does?

[37:34]

Patience. Patience, thank you. Yeah. Peter? It seems like at the center of that little hub where the rooster and the pig and the snake inhabit, there's this place where, you know, maybe as humans we experience life as kind of impermanent or unsatisfactory or something uncomfortable and that greed, hate and delusion are things we kind of take a ride on to divert our attention from that. And if we can just keep our attention on the basic quality of our life, you know, it's a big step up. That's a good point. to really base our behavior on the quality of life, which replaces the hub of the greed, hate, and delusion.

[38:42]

I think that You know, greed, hate and delusion, ill will and delusion are called the three poisonous roots. So, the opposite of that is called absence of that. But really, it's generosity replaces greed. Goodwill replaces, loving kindness replaces ill will. wisdom replaces delusion. But I think that's what you mean by being quality. Well, I guess what I mean is that maybe the moment which we turn away from and we're always doing it.

[39:58]

Yeah. To just take your stand where you are and see the quality and appreciate where you are on each moment. Yeah, I think that's the bottom line, is to really appreciate what we have, where we are, who we are on each moment. Thank you. I feel very fortunate to be able to come here and sort of be reminded that I'm constantly operating under some delusion or another. I feel like I've really been taking a ride on greed, hate, and delusion the last couple of weeks. I've actually been really surprised at how agitated and impatient I've been the last couple of weeks, I've had more conflicts with people in the last couple of weeks than I've had in the last many months.

[40:58]

One of the things that, you mentioned something at the beginning, but of course I can't remember it, I was going to ask you to say it again, but you did say something about education, and one of the things that I'm feeling some struggle about is when I start having conversations with people about what's going on. The other day I was talking to someone and he was going on about all the protesters and like what you hear in the parks on the radio, well they should go to Justin Herman class and that's where they should protest. And I said, well, no, that's not going to do it. He said, well, what if you had like a $10,000 job, and they were protesting on your street, and you couldn't get out of your house, what would you do? And he said, well, wouldn't you be upset? And I thought about it, and I thought, yeah, I'd be upset. And it hit me, and I said, yeah, I'd be upset, and I wouldn't want it to be happening, but I hoped what I would do is remember that I've got a house for someone to protest in front of and there's all these people who are getting their houses bombed and that's the first interaction I think I've had with someone about the war and the protests who feel differently than me that didn't end up in a big argument and I am

[42:14]

really struggling with how to educate because I get so caught up in in wanting them to know that the way I feel is the right way and they have to learn it and I don't know how to educate without going into battle. Well in a time of crisis people do the expedient thing which is called protest and it stops business as usual. The thing that keeps things going is business as usual. I think there are so many people in the country who, because our lives go from day to day on business as usual, if there's a gap in that, you know, one day of not working or something, you stop the cycle. or you damage the cycle. And so because people are so focused on this, any interruption is seen as unacceptable.

[43:23]

So part of protesting is to interrupt business as usual. And maybe not intentionally, sometimes intentionally, but not necessarily intentionally. It's that this is what brings attention. to what people feel is a counter cause or a counter to the big problem. So the people feel it is not so bad you know but it's you know the one side on the one hand it stops them from stop people from their routine on the other hand and that's bad the other hand it stops them from their routine and that's good so how do we educate though I mean how do we well you know in times when it's not so critical

[44:29]

there are different kinds of education. That's why the ongoing, to keep an ongoing education for a peaceful world is not something that comes up just when there's a crisis, but it should be going on and on all the time. It has to be going on all the time. You know, there's always been this idea of having a Bureau of Peace or something in the government, you know. What is it called? Cabinet Peace. Yeah, like a cabinet position for a peace minister. But nobody wants, I mean, nobody in the government wants that. Or if they did, you know, it wouldn't, you know, But we have to keep lobbying for that.

[45:36]

We have to keep making effort to make that happen. Robert? This is a difficult question that I've been asking myself. And I believe that war is morally wrong. But then what are we supposed to do Okay, there are different kinds of wars. World War II was a response to an attack. So when you're attacked in that way by an aggressor, you have to respond. You have to do something. But this particular war is not a response to that. It's simply a trumped-up... I mean, everybody in the world knows it's just a trumped-up deal.

[46:37]

I mean, nobody can justify it in terms of attacking a dangerous country that's dangerous to us. It's just, you know, all put together. for a different purpose. So that's what's so outrageous about this particular situation, is that everybody can see through the facade. Bill? Thank you for trying to help us through this puzzle. Next, forgive me, but not everybody knows. You stay there.

[48:00]

for one day. Individuals, communities, the nation, the invitation goes out to them never not to use it. I'd be very curious how well or poorly we do in the spirit of sacrifice about stopping the use of oil and proving to ourselves that our goal really is honor. Yeah, I see. That's a great idea. I love riding my bike. You still have to use oil, though. What? You still have to use oil, though. Yeah, I have to use oil. Well, there's a difference between using oil and devouring oil. There's a difference between using oil and having oil use you. You mentioned different realms all existing at the same time, and I'm not fully educated on all the aspects of Buddhist theology, but I had read previously some Hindu theology, and it's more a sense of one life after the other, reincarnation, starting in the low realm and ending up in the high realm.

[50:27]

And you had said that they all exist at once. I didn't say they all exist at once. I'm sorry. I said they're all right here in the various realms, worlds that are in this world. What intrigued me was you were talking about how we all go back and forth between those different realms. Yeah. Is that more of the I don't like to use the word reincarnation. It means the flesh is continued after another birth. Rebirth has a lot of different connotations. There are many different ways of looking at the

[51:28]

But Buddhist view is different than the Hindu view, because in Hinduism there's a soul that transmigrates from one life to another. In Buddhism that's not the case. So it's a different way of viewing rebirth. It's not the same. As a matter of fact, one of Buddha's main doctrines was his departure from that Brahman ideal, understanding. I want to acknowledge that I've been very angry since the bombing started. To be kind of flippant, I'd like to thank you for explaining why the rich need a tax cut.

[52:36]

It's because they're very poor. Yeah, they can never get enough. They live in dire poverty. Okay, we have to stop soon. In the back. Oh, I was just going to comment. Thank you again. I really appreciate the generosity that you provide in this space. I work for an organization that is supposed to be environmentally progressive. I work for an organization that is supposed to be environmentally progressive, and many people there are very committed to saving the environment by providing information on all kinds of transportation. However, unfortunately, and she is a nice woman, our boss, the executive director, is pro-war.

[53:40]

So there's a contradiction in leadership there. And I've recently been having lunch with this woman and finding a level that we can converse on. And I have found that to be very encouraging because I was able to speak to her about the sadness I feel for the loss and this bombing of children's lives potentially and the environment. And I said, Catherine, do you not see that it isn't just our environment in this city, in the Bay Area, it's the world we need to open our hearts to. And because I talked from my heart, I feel that she was touched. And I feel that that is the only way to educate, is to really talk about your feelings. I may not have changed her political point of view, but I know that I strengthened something in encouraging the heart to be open.

[54:51]

And I risked myself and my potential there for my job. People have said, oh no, don't talk to her. But I know I have to. This is where there was nothing to save except the moment All right, and that's good way to wake people up Meryl I wanted to go maybe a little on the other side enters a field where we are very much focused on external action. And I think that Buddhism in the West is actually entering into a much more active mood than Buddhism ever has been.

[56:02]

And I recall our February Sashin, which was actually split Robert's question. It is a Buddhist politics that requires imagining, that requires creativity, that requires coming out of our practice and going into the world with ideas, with structures, with concepts that are really flourishing. And I would just throw out a couple of good pieces that have appeared in Harper's recently by Jonathan Schell, who made such a big splash with his Fate of the Earth back in the 80s that was a cornerstone of the anti-nuclear movement.

[57:05]

He now has a new book called The Unconquerable Earth, which essentially is an argument against war, showing its complete ineffectiveness, but he's doing rather than a personal one. So I just would like to make a pitch for us to, it's great in our everyday life. I certainly find that in my everyday life, I need all of this input about dealing with my own turmoil, but we need also to think about the future, things outside of the present moment. We need to realize that the forces that we are dealing with are planning the next step are thinking about Iran, we have to be anticipating this with our own imaginations and our own practice. Thank you.

[58:06]

I just had a quick comment, because what I saw in the streets of San Francisco on Thursday ties in quite a bit to what you said. I saw two people from the Berkeley Zen Center who had been training in nonviolent communication, go into the crowd and calm down situations that were potentially very dangerous and explosive. And it was, they did a number of things, but one of them was to take people aside, police, protesters, and ask them how they were feeling. On TV one day, when it was focusing on the protesters, a couple of people were saying how great the police were, how they felt that the police were just doing their job and that they were

[59:06]

I'm not angry with them and so forth. It's a mixed bag, but I think for people, I mean, that kind of attitude, I think, to really bring the police in, not as opposition, but as people, that's where it's at. Thank you very much.

[59:37]

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