Unsurpassed, penetrating and perfect karma is rarely met with, even in a hundred thousand million kalpas, having it to see and listen to, to remember and accept. the truth of the Tathagata's words. Good morning. This is the first time I've been asked to give a Dharma talk. Thank you Linda and Greg for your confidence and trust in me. And it's a warm-hearted feeling to give this first arm a talk with so many old and new friends.

[01:22]

There is a curriculum, there is an assignment. The tradition is that the first talk of a chuseau is about a koan given by a teacher. The senior students know all about this They're asking me what my koan, what was I given? It's really, it's a rite of passage like a bar mitzvah. You read a portion of the Torah in Hebrew and commented on it coherently and then you're an adult in the community. And you get presents. I got this present here. this sutra cloth sewed by hand by Gene Selkirk and others, and I guess they're making me a new rock suit. This one's pretty shabby, so I'm glad to share these new beginnings.

[02:26]

Now for me, I don't have to learn to read an ancient language, so really I should be set up for success. It should be pretty easy. But this koan literature, it is tricky. And one way to think about the trickiness or talk about the trickiness is that it's really difficult to translate. It's not quite routine these days for people to talk about koans here. But Sojin did routinely talk about koans. And I can tell you that there were times when he brought the enlightenment of these exchanges right into the room. And I was dazzled and thunderstruck by the possibility and the potential of this literature.

[03:34]

Other times he seemed so weighed down by the ponderous burden of translating, he was in the role of a college professor, explaining these deliberately vague Chinese and Japanese idioms, untangling the layers of references to literature I had no knowledge of. And we have a founding principle in our temple of beginner's mind. But this body of literature sometimes it seemed like, well, you need a master's degree education in East Asian literature just to begin to approach it. But even if it wasn't about this translation, these would still be tricky. These are representations of enlightenment.

[04:38]

And we can't quite put enlightenment into words. There's no reason why even Shakyamuni Buddha or Shinryu Suzuki can't write a book that sorts us all out. It's the nature of language that language only sheds light on one side. It's discriminating awareness in Buddhism. And enlightenment, it's both sides at once, of all sides at once. One thing we learn in Zen, if you say something, you also say its opposite. If we say up, we also say down. In the reference point of our thinking mind, we can divide them, but outside that reference point, they are undivided.

[05:52]

If we say birth, we also say death. In the reference point of our thinking mind, we can divide them, but outside that reference point, they are indivisible. If we say form, we say emptiness. If we say finite, we say infinite. So we can divide them in our mind, but outside of our mind, they are undivided. And if we say we sit zazen, not to realize enlightenment, but to express our inherent enlightenment. We also say we've taken a solemn vow to wake up from the dream of senseless suffering for the benefit of all beings. So these koans are not literary stories we can do literary analysis on.

[07:07]

They're not even parables conveying an idea. We couldn't understand them, and they're not intended to be understood, because to understand would be to understand one side. Instead, they're a possibility or door to empty ourselves so that we might step into this conversation It includes both sides at once. My first memory of Zen as an idea is my freshman year at college. I knew I wanted to be a religion major. I was taking the first course, Introduction to World Religions. And the textbook, I'm sure many of you have read it, The World's Religions by Houston Smith.

[08:16]

He was a UC Berkeley professor here. And my class was taught by one of his students. I actually met Houston Smith in the dermatologist's office five blocks off the street in Milvia Street. The receptionist called out Houston Smith's name. Are you the Houston Smith, creator of the academic vocabulary of religious pluralism? I'm like, this guy's a big deal. And he wasn't offended by my violation of his HIPAA privacy. He was glad to have a fan. I don't think that comes up. And we talked, he had been here. He knew Berkeley Zen Center, knew Sojin. And I have this visual memory of taking the final exam in a big hall.

[09:26]

It's funny because there's this vaulted window and the light came down on my paper and illuminated this one multiple choice question. What is different between Zen and other forms of Buddhism? It could have been what is different between Zen and other religions. And if you studied the vocabulary list, you did know the answer. It was sudden enlightenment. Kensho. Satori. That's how things look to a professor of comparative religion. And so the teaching, well, in other forms of Buddhism and other religions for that matter, there's a gradual path to enlightenment.

[10:29]

We're purifying the kleshas. We're purifying sins. We're uncovering unconscious entanglements with grasping and aversion and indifference. And we do this because we've come to understand from the Buddha's teachings that grasping and aversion and indifference consistently leads to suffering and confusion. And there's no way around patiently going through this process as we go through the different experiences of our life. And of course, here, we're Buddhists before we're Zen. This is our path, undoubtedly. And it's a privilege to share this path and maintain this vehicle, which is a raft in the ocean

[11:45]

of human suffering. A lamp in the night of human confusion. And we know this is a method or a community of people looking for a method to move from stress to peace of mind. to move from neurosis to sanity so that we can store up our treasure in heaven where moth and rust do not decay. And then there's this other side of sudden enlightenment. If you see through that this self that we presume is at the center of our entanglement, the grasping, the aversion, the indifference, if you see through this self never existed, well then, grasping and aversion and indifference, the stress is dispelled.

[13:19]

When you wake up from a dream, the problems of the dream are completely gone. You don't have to go back and get the dream checked and the dream mail to keep the dream electricity on. We've seen that a person suffering these problems and the problems they suffered is only in our mind and we can leave them behind. Most of these koans come from the transmission of the lamp literature. So that's where the lineage of Zen masters was written into the record. So they have this grammar of teacher talks to student, student talks to teacher, teacher talks to student, student wakes up.

[14:32]

That's the credential they need to establish. You know, I've been a part of religious traditions which create community by sharing stories about the past. And no doubt we can have strong emotions about stories about the past and convey values and meaning, but... I came to feel like if they're just about the past, well, they just end up being baggage. They just end up being abstractions. that become eccentric.

[15:36]

And so for me, it was always a question, well, we have these stories in the past, are there any contemporary stories like that? But Kensho or Satori, is this our story too? Or is this just symbolizing something that happened in the past? There's a preamble. I want to bring up the one time I did hear a story like that in this room. And I want to do it because I hope this near mirror might illuminate what could be found in the distant mirror of this. ancient koan literature. I didn't read this story in a book. It wasn't published in a magazine. It wasn't the subject of a lecture.

[16:39]

And in three sentences, you could have overlooked it if you weren't listening to it every time you were in this room. One day in the middle of a lecture, Sojun said, I was talking about this place. And Suzuki Roshi said, why are you talking about someplace where you've never been? And I had an experience of Kensho. Well, there's no labor of translation here. It's right on the surface. Like the TARDIS in Doctor Who, it's bigger on the inside. My imagination, I wonder, where could Sojourn have been talking about?

[17:45]

You know, the Greek islands with their whitewashed walls and the blue roof set against the Mediterranean Sea, Both so simple and peaceful, but joyful. I really love that. I think more plausibly, oh, at Eheji Monastery in Japan, they just serve rice and pickles. They have things so much better. Here at Tassahara. But it doesn't actually matter. It didn't matter when he told the story. The fact that he had never been there just reflected that he was talking about. And this talking about it isn't just a momentary lapse of presence. This is our life. This is the dream in which we sleep. Why are you talking about someplace where you've never been?

[18:49]

Our whole lives we spend talking about, thinking about. We can hardly be present with each other, talking about, thinking about. We've hardly been anywhere because we're in our heads talking about, thinking about. And if you look, well, where could you find the exit from this? How would you stop? Is it four walls of a prison cell? Okay, if you stepped your toe and cried out in pain, you wouldn't be talking about, you'd be expressing yourself fully. If you finally confess the love in your heart, maybe even if you finally confess the hate,

[19:54]

in your heart, you wouldn't be talking about, you'd be expressing yourself. If you lost yourself performing a piece of music that you had mastered, you wouldn't be talking about, you'd be expressing yourself. Many times our emotions overwhelm our persona, and we forget our persona, and we mean what we say 100%. But when they recalm again, we go back to talking about. But why are you talking about someplace you've never been? Why are you talking about Are the birds singing about?

[20:56]

Do cats purr about? Here we are, the whole universe is set in motion to bring our point of view into existence. We're dreaming we're an object standing relative to other objects. Sojin was in that dream and he was contacted by the presence of his teacher and he had an experience of Kensho. With that, I'll introduce case 78 from the Blue Cliff Record. In olden times, there were 16 Bodhisattvas. When it was time to wash, they followed the custom and entered the bathhouse. Suddenly, they awakened to the practice of water.

[22:08]

All you Zen students, subtle feeling reveals illumination, and we are now children of Buddha. At once, you must puncture seven and penetrate eight. And there's something that happens suddenly. at once puncturing and penetrating. It's not a gradual process or something inherent. And there's a key to this that would be familiar to the audience of the Blue Cliff Record. This case does not come from that transmission of the lamp literature. It's one of only a couple. This case comes from the Surangama Sutra. If I mention the Surangama Sutra, I have to mention our friend Bob Rosenbaum, who wrote a book about the Surangama Sutra.

[23:16]

That is not your mind. Besides bringing forth a lot of fresh expressions of dharma, it has dozens of stories about his experience practicing at Berkeley Zen Center. Sojin and Meili and others, and any member of this community would enjoy spending time with that. But in this story from the Surangama Sutra, Ananda, who has memorized all the discourses, was a right hand, a Buddha, Buddha's cousin, servant, body servant, But famously, he was slow to realize enlightenment.

[24:17]

And so he asks Buddha, well, can you just really make it simple? How? How do I wake up? I'm really frustrated, but I see other people. And Buddha asks, turns the question over to the community, asks them, well, what would you tell Ananda about the simplest way to wake up, the most direct way? And the first person steps forward and says, sound, the contemplation of sound is the best way. Second person comes forward and says, contemplation of smell. is the best way. And there are 25, but our story ends with number three. As Badra Paula comes forth and says this, which is the source you'll recognize from this koan.

[25:21]

When it was time to bathe, I followed the custom and entered the bathhouse. Suddenly, upon contact with the water, I understood that the water was neither washing away the dirt nor washing my body. In the midst of this, I became tranquil, and I understood there was nothing there. The Buddha has asked us how we broke through to enlightenment. Having considered what I have attained, I believe that the contemplation of tangible objects is the best method. Okay, for me to visualize this, I have to go to the baths in Tassajara. I'm talking about some place I've never been, but I don't know where else I can imagine 16 monks in a hot pool, thinking about.

[26:35]

And they may be up to their necks, their shoulders in water. And they look around. And descending out of their thoughts, they feel this sensation of water touching their skin. And they can see that the emptiness between them is no different from the emptiness inside them. under one field of sensation. And one of the reasons I think Greg and Linda chose this koan, you know, is it suits our community right now. If there's any possibility that we are waiting for the Abbot to come, and ascend her mountain seat.

[27:41]

And that until then maybe we're waiting for enlightenment to be possible again in this community. Waiting for it to be introduced. And we have the testimony of this tradition instead that just among us, We have everything we need for our journey. Please understand this isn't a story that happened a long time ago. It's not even a metaphor. It's not a story about water or bathing. Did you know that human beings have no ability to feel water? Cockroaches can and bees can. They can sense moisture and have nerves specifically for that purpose.

[28:48]

But human beings, we learned the differential in temperature, pressure. So here we are all 60 or 70 bodhisattvas. We're not in a bath washing our bodies. But we are here in this temple washing our grasping, aversion, indifference. We're too united in one field of touch. sitting on our cushions, legs on the zahvatan, zahvatan on the tan, tan on the floor, floor on the foundation, foundation on the earth, pushing down and lifting up in perfect balance.

[29:58]

And if you don't know where in this world to look for truth, where to look for wholeness or freedom, will have the testimony of our tradition that they're completely here in this sensation of touch. And, you know, it directly addresses a mystery or is a resource for a point in our practice, like, how can it even make sense that We're sitting here, and our legs hurt. And the instruction isn't, oh, please be at ease and be comfortable. The instruction is, no, don't move. How long can this countercultural practice endure? But when we can no longer turn away from wholeness, from freedom, from truth, well, that's when our opportunity is ripest.

[31:20]

I'd like to be able to say, well, it's just as simple as that. Just come down over our heads and we Identify not with our thoughts, but with our sensations, and then everything would be revealed. In the Blue Cliff Record though, there are 100 stories of sudden enlightenment. Not one. Toes on, sat down. crossed his legs, and he put his hands in the cosmic mudra, and he put his tongue on the roof of his mouth, and he had his spine straight, and he breathed into his belly and followed his breath, and he woke up! Not one! In each story, what's necessary is to be surprised as well.

[32:35]

to be surprised by someone else. Can we be surprised to find ourselves together here? The whole universe was set in motion to bring us together in this moment. Can we be surprised to meet each other for the first time? And we'd be surprised, and in this shared field of touch, we're not only 70 separate thinking minds, but also one, undivided. And that's been some of my practice in the last couple of weeks of this practice period.

[33:47]

Can I leave a separate identity that I come in with, come in the door with, and be one thing with you? And I hope we might explore this possibility together with diligence, this practice period. Thank you. you said in our practice we are encouraged to not move.

[35:09]

And earlier you said that in Zen we bring up the opposite, which I would imagine means it's okay to move. So how do we reconcile not moving and moving in order for the Dharma to continue? We have this instruction about how to practice, which is not moving, but that includes not moving of a corpse. It's the not moving of a living person, which is always dynamically active. So what does don't move mean? Well, we say it as a rule. We say it to encourage others.

[36:10]

Are you encouraged by it? I would have moved if somebody didn't scold me. Thank you very much. Thank you for your talk, Mark. Earlier in your talk, you said something along the lines of, we wake up from the dream of senseless suffering. Is there suffering with a sense or a purpose? No. Thank you. Ellen? Thank you, Mark. I'm sort of in the same space maybe as Ross. I think you said that we can, you know, we talk about opposites, say finite and infinite, sort of within our mind, but outside of our mind they aren't separate.

[37:19]

What does that mean to be outside of the mind? Both sides exist at once. Inside our mind and outside our mind? What's outside our mind? Outside our thinking mind is a vast universe, but our big mind includes all of that. So that's still our mind? Yes. That's how I said, thinking mind. the reference point of that thinking mind, we create these distinctions, but outside that reference point. Mark, Steve, I noticed you didn't call me, so I'm just gonna remind you of my name.

[38:29]

Thank you. What I really appreciated about the talk, so first what I appreciated to my question, first what I really appreciated was that it really resonates with R.A.M. right now in that within a couple of weeks, I'm going to be going to England to train to become a teacher of religious education. So just like the spirit of this talk is very deep for me. Now my question. If the practice is to be with what's tangible, the water, washing over us, it may not be washing over us, it may or may not, to be with the tangible thing. How is penetrating seven into eight tangible? Well, the penetrating is seven senses or eight senses,

[39:30]

And I'm not really sure I understand this penetration. I think you can throw dream punches forever. And the metaphor I came back to and related to is waking up. But there's some confrontation of our habit to fall asleep. There's some rousing of an intention to challenge that habit. And that's what I think the... penetrating and puncturing this. Hannah? So I had a little Kensho experience during the talk, which is that we have a practice, a very important practice here, penetrating the concrete. I'm working right now on fitting the slightly smaller lining of an envelope to the slightly larger.

[40:35]

And I'm pinning those lines exactly, just as we pin and sew the lines of our boxes. So I think we need that. Yes, thank you, Hannah. I don't see any. There are no hands up online. Soon. Thank you for your talk. I am broken apart. You seem to take me into a place that feels very strange.

[41:40]

I'm not used to living in that space. Can you tell me, can you say your koan again, please? You're safe here, Sue. In olden times, there were sixteen bodhisattvas. When it was time to wash, they followed the custom and entered the bathhouse. Suddenly, they awakened to the practice of water. All you Zen students, subtle feeling reveals illumination, and we are now children of Buddha. At once you must puncture seven and penetrate eight. Thank you.

[42:45]

Thank you, Mark. You said human beings are not capable of feeling water, not like monkeys and birds and fish. But I disagree. That's what our inside mind tells us. But beyond the senses, I'm sure I'm waiting myself I'm sure I will be able to feel the water. That's my hope. Thank you. Thank you. Is there a difference between the practice of water and the contemplation of water?

[44:09]

Let's talk about contemplation. They awaken to the practice of water. Practice is something descended from And contemplation sounds like you're considering an idea. And it wouldn't be an idea that... The practice of water wouldn't be an idea. Thank you. There is a hand raised on line now. Judy? Thank you, Mark. With what mind, with what water would 16 fighting demons awaken to bodhisattva activity together?

[45:33]

You know, all these points of the cosmology, they go in a circle. You know, the demon goes to a god, and of course they say only humans can awaken. There's a different bodhisattva in each of those realms. How do the folks in the fighting demon realm recognize They are not separate. Perhaps swimming in being the same water as the Bodhisattva. What mind is that? Do you know, Judy, what would you say? I would say Shuso, what mind is that? I would tell you that the cosmology says they're continuing in their karmic path as fighting demons.

[47:04]

And there is no exit from their karmic path as fighting demons until they are balanced as humans. They're just on the wheel. Up and down. Are you speaking to something about our shared humanity? Well, I might also be describing our circumstance where fighting demons are how to pacify them. Well, nobody has the answer to that. We haven't learned that. The Dalai Lama has tried to pacify fighting demons. I don't have an answer where these failed.

[48:06]

I like that don't know mind. Thank you, Shuso. Gary? Shuso. It's no secret that I swim a lot. I swim five days a week. So I'm familiar somewhat with water. Living in Northern California in the morning to get in the water is freezing and I swim in an outdoor pool. So I come up to the edge and then I plunge in and I'm freezing. And then I start to swim right away. And as I swim, I feel the water, how cold it is. And I get to the other end and I swim back and suddenly I start to feel the warmth of the water. And then I turn around and I swim the next length.

[49:11]

And I start to feel the water. And it's soothing. It's like massaging me. And it's just so great. How do you explain all that? The change. That's so healthy. Plunge into cold water. It's really... getting very popular these days. It activates your dopamine and your circulation and your skin. Sounds so healthy, Gary. And then the head, like the third length, the head starts to feel comforted, like a cool feeling around the head. I don't know. You don't have to.

[50:15]

There's one more online. Hey, Jake and Leslie. Thank you, Mark. Staying with water. For as long as I can remember, water has been part of me. I'm wondering if you have had a great water experience during your life, or perhaps many. What is your experience with water? You know, I was a lifeguard and that was such a great job. And I do think taking cold showers is a habit that really adds something to my life recently. And I had a friend who almost drowned and really faced their own death.

[51:28]

So that seems It's not all. Friendly. Jake, did you have an experience of water for yourself? I have. I nearly drowned once when I was young, and I knew that was what was happening. Also, backpacking. Often, hot and sweaty, you find a creek or river, find a rock, lay down, put your head under, keep your eyes open, come up, and I would just say, head dunker. My friend who almost drowned, it was a transformative point for them to face their death like that.

[52:30]

It was not my experience, but I could see it through their eyes. Thank you. Beings are numerous. I vow to awaken with them. Delusions are inexhaustible. I Thank you. Special welcome to anyone joining for their first time here in the Zendo or online.

[55:34]

My name is Shoren and I'm today's Saturday director and I have some announcements. Spring practice period participants are encouraged to sign up for tea and discussion with Shuso Mark Copperthorn. The sign up sheet with dates and times are on the bulletin board in the courtyard. This afternoon, starting at 3.30, we are having our mid-practice period dinner and skits. There's still time to sign up to help. Also, you can see the bulletin board. Tomorrow, there is a half-day sitting from 8 a.m. to noon. Next Monday, Genson Thompson will give a way-seeking mind talk at 8 a.m. in the online Zendo. Registration is now open for the five-day Sashin, June 11th to 15th, to close our spring practice period. Please see the website or listserv to register. The sign-up deadline is Monday, June 2nd. The Wednesday drop-in group meets from 7, 10 to 9 p.m., and the group particularly welcomes newcomers to Zen practice.

[56:40]

For more information, contact Ikushinjeri Jaliba. Her email is in the links for recurring activities. She's also here today. BCC has a queer Dharma group that meets in the community room on the second and fourth Mondays of the month from 7 to 8, 15 PM. This group welcomes those who identify as LGBTQ+, as well as anyone who may be questioning or exploring their identity. please contact me at the T or you could also email Pauline Christian for more information. And also just an announcement to anyone who's new, if you have belongings like a large bag and purse, please bring them into the Zendo with you. You can store them under the Tan as opposed to leaving them in the courtyard. For more information about our programs or membership, please check the bulletin board outside see the Zoom chat for those on Zoom, or anyone can visit the website berkeleyzencenter.org.

[57:42]

Did you have your hand up, Sue? There's a Orioki refresher training next Saturday, and if you'd like, I think the sign-up's on the board. Thank you. So you can also sign up for Orioki training on the bulletin board as well. To make a donation to support BCC, you can use the donation box set up in the courtyard or visit the website and click the generosity tab. And lastly, I will need two volunteers to have time to stay after tea today who can help wash teacups. All right, thank you. Those in the Zendo, please maintain silence while we exit until we're off the Zendo porch. And those online, please feel free to unmute and greet each other. Thanks, everyone. Thank you. Thank you. Bye, everyone. Bye.

[58:42]

Take care. Have a good weekend, everyone. Yes. You too. Have a good weekend. Thank you.

[59:03]

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