Three Refuges

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real question
the bracket practice it's based on
it's based on our own
experience in our own verification
when we take refuge in the dharma we entered the path of transformation the path to end suffering when we take refuge in sanga we focus our energy on building a community that dwells in mindfulness
so
as i said desert desert there's two steps to the process of initiation
ah there's the step of going for refuge
and then the undertaking of the of the precepts
ha by the former step one commit oneself to the three jewels
and by the latter step one spells out the principles by which one is going to live
the usual process
of are buddhist initiation and actually have almost all of our ceremonies for those of you have been around
is
beginning with
first within a vowel
of our karma all my ancient twisted con alma from big english
greed hate and delusion i now fully a vow
and then it's a vowel and repentance at the same time
and then we take refuge the refuge returns us to the center to balance and from that refuge than we step forward
into our life again we stepped forward ah carrying that refuge with us like the snail's shell
so am i wanna stop from time to time here and just see if you please if you have any questions them as them now as them as we go along

the trump glory
i'm just wondering the faith makes me think of a oh that maybe daniel had a question to know i had going as interest
makes me think of all
do we believe in buddha kind of like people believe in god or or
how does a jive with
that somehow that's the next portion of my presentation talk i thank you thank you that's a good question gale

ah there we
ah how do we like
do you just like at some point in the unlike the day like put on the shell and then it just honest the day
well that's a really good question actually there's two
the refuge is manifest in a couple of different ways first of all it's initiation it's the initiation by which one enters the practice of being a buddhist
but then
technically speaking
ah at least in early buddhism for for monks or one is encouraged to recite the precepts twice daily
and i think for us ah
we recite them
frequently in our services in our in our ceremonies and so there's a long with the initiatory ah
the initiatory
expression of the precepts of the of the refugees there is in and everyday renewal of them we constantly have to renew them they remind us of the path that ron doesn't make sense
yeah
let's see there's plenty
yeah so
the question ah

there are fears the internal and external manifestation of the precepts
and i think on
the external is
kind of obvious amid the external is
ah
the bows that we doing the zendo the way we handle our dharma books
the way we value the sanga and how we conduct ourselves as each other this is this is the external dimension ah
and
it's important
ah
yeah so you could call the external extra refugees devotion to the buddha and bodhisattvas it is our study of the teachings
and it is the way that we practice with community
but a lot of our teachers
sighs the internal refuge
so again if we look at to not harm

he says in chinese and vietnamese practitioner is always say i go back and rely on the buddha in myself
adding in myself makes it clear that we ourselves are the buddha when we take refuge in buddha we must also understand the bureau takes refuge in me
without the second part the first part is not complete

during the boot is last months
he taught take refuge in yourself nodding anything else in you are buddha dharma and sangha don't look for things that are far away
everything is in your own heart be an island unto yourself
so this is echoed in in many different places ha
suzuki roshi road
taking refuge is not a good translation
taking refuge refugees to protect yourself in buddha's home if you know how to protect yourself that translation may work
but to take refuge in buddha looks like to escape from this world and to go to buddha but it's not actually so
to be one with buddha is to take refuge in buddha or to be buddha yourself is to take refuge in buddha
there's no special home for buddha or for us the home is always within ourselves
so does not to go to buddha
it is defined to the nature within ourselves that is to take refuge in buddha
and tick not on also says there's no external sip safety
there's refuge the refuge at we take
is in ourselves
and this refuge is our manifestation of faith and it's the it's the practice of face the activity of faith not the activity of faith in him something external
now the source for all of them i think
is
what we find in the teaching of the sixth ancestor
ha willing
who is that
who's suppose it narrator of the platform sutra whether that's the case or not ah an think we'll ever know but
someone articulated these teachings and they're very powerful to us
ha
in the section in the platform sutra on repentance
he says let the enlightened one be your teacher
we should testify to ourselves by constantly appealing to the three jewels of our essence of mind
i advise you to take refuge
to let our minds take refuge in the light in enlightenment
so that evil and delusive notions do not arise desire decrease his discontent is unknown
lust and greed no longer bind
enlightenment is what he calls the buddha
the buddha is freedoms the buddha is enlightenment so that's the first just
in the translation that i have his second refuge what we take as ha
taking refuge in the dharma ha
he has had to let our mind take refuge in orthodoxy
because little troublesome for some fuss as a word right orthodoxy ah
but he says take refuge in orthodoxy means another way to express his ah
in soto zen in a three pure precepts
ah one of the three purpose precepts
in the first girl step it i vowed to avoid all evil is framed i vow to embrace and sustain all ceremonies and regulations
never again this is hard for us some now culturally this gap doesn't compute but what he means here by taking refuge in orthodoxy he says so that we are always free from wrong views
for without wrong views
we'll be free from egotism arrogance a craving this is the best way to get rid of desire so that's what what orthodoxy means actually is
an admitted to the soto verse do is selected substitute these regulations
for the wily ways of our mind that wanna pull us into these are these different problematic areas
and then
his last point is to let our mind take refuge in purity
and this is this is what he says for
sanga
let us let her mind take refuge in purity so that no matter in what circumstances it may be it will not be contaminated by worries himself object sense objects craving and desire this is the novelist quality of mankind so he takes it from the
a particular distortions of our mind into something fundamental about our humanness
they said this is the sixty and system
ha
to practice the threefold guidance
means to keep refuge in oneself
in one's essence of mind
ignorant people take the threefold guidance night and day but do not understand
if they say they take refuge in buddha do they know where he is
yet if you cannot see the buddha how can you take refuge in him
flirted audience each of you should consider and examined this point for yourself and let not your energy may be misapplied
the sutra says that we should take refuge in the buddha within ourselves
it does not suggest that we should take refuge in other buddhists
moreover if we do not if we do not take refuge in buddha within ourselves
where else is it that we could retreat
let us take refuge in the three gems within our mind within we take control of our mind without and extra external we should be respectful to others
this is the way we make refuge within ourselves
one of the buddhist most widely quoted phrases in know
bali is at a deeper surinam which means taking refuge suriname in the island deeper of self
some i'm going to stop there and again leave some space for a questions or comments i i i hope this responded to lorries question ah but please feel free to ah to go ahead ask
see jonathan as his hand up
i thank you for some and
i hear what you say that the did
six ancestor teaching us to take refuge within ourselves
at the risk of getting into a comparative religion discussion which i don't know is a great idea and i wonder if we could save new words about schools like cherishing or need your van the other power schools
very as i understand it
he know know their do you absolutely take refuge in something outside of yourself
i'm you take refuge in amida buddha and and you gotta try it
i'm wondering and i
i hope that the answer isn't just said he know well you know that's our ancestors right and nurses wrong and i'm wondering if there's a way to to reconcile those beliefs thank you yeah well
i've been thinking about this
ha in my experience
i had a really strong experience hum
this trip that i made to rome for
buddhist catholic dialogue a few years ago and they were representatives of various ah mostly asian american buddhist communities from the united states and we met with
catholic priests nuns theologians and had a dialogue about suffering
and it happened on that trip festival
i think i got invited because they thought it was japanese
they thought senaki was up it's a they were pretty surprised when a person japanese but anyway i was really happy to be there i'm
and there was a delegation of garage shinshu practitioners
what i have was tremendously drawn to them because they were very straightforward simple
not simple people but very straightforward there a manner was was simple and straightforward and they were awake
now
one of the places i've come to is actually asking
to me there's there's a false dualism between the so-called other school other power school like george shoe and each other in this is the is depicted in japanese buddhism and
and ah the zen school which is normally a self power school
i really don't accept that
find a way that i think about it is
how did i get here
how did i get to berkeley zen center and walk in the door
now i had to walking under my own muscular power but what called me there i really don't understand it's something beyond me
and
i think that
there are mysteries in our universe that we we cannot understand
and i also think that
we have to be really careful about what we call ha within self
so i'm i'm looking here you know
i see joel and i see diane and i see been and i see the top of lorries head
we're all part in this visual reality
we are oneself
with different manifestations so to take refuge in oneself i think it does mean reflecting inwardly it means as as will be sent taking the backward step that turns to light inward
at the same time when we turn a light inward we see that
we are home to
countless sentient beings of our mind
hello thinking beings of her mind our interactive with all the other sentient beings in universe so the self is not so limited it's not limited by this bag of skin to me so i don't find that a contradiction
know that if that answers your question
stanley something to chew on thank you yeah i mean it's really good to look at here's a book by d t suzuki which kind of ah looks at
the interrelationship of the self-powered other power schools admitted this is a function this is an an aspect of japanese buddhism i don't see it as an aspect of have any other one of the things that you see is that if you look at chinese buddhism
or indian buddhism is that they were practicing and a whole range of practices ah the oppressor practice devotional practice ha purely and practices
and so forth ah the physical practices but what japanese buddhism often get pretty is involved was break each of these practices off into a separate school
so our school really highlights meditation
lv be quite true that any one practice is sufficient if done ah
you know if done thoroughly but on if you go to down block to the berkeley buddhist monastery which is related to the city of ten thousand buddhas ah you will see that in any given day they go through a whole cycle of
actresses and they see that has buddhism not any one particular approach methodology
so ben
i thank you hassan
i was struck by
something in the reading
this idea of relying on which i quite like cause some that's been a deep dharma question for me what really is there to rely on and
at least one answer i've encountered is
i'm nothing it leaves nothing permanently i can only rely on what's peer right now but there seems to be something and take the huns teaching here
where there's some
something more eternal dare i say about the three jewels bye week but i know that impermanence
is the law so i wonder if you could say something about how buddha dharma and sangha are reliable even though everything is always changing and falling away
well first of all to translate the chinese term chinese term is green
and it means literally to return and rely on so green needs to take refuge in to lead on to follow to be in accord with to rely on
to go home
ah any means support or basis
and so this is a basis that one can rely on i really like you know when we were when we learn to so we you are sewing of a rocker zoo or okay so ah we we used the japanese aggression namo create boot so
i take refuge in to to in buddha num okay then we there's also for the three hundred number ki ho nam okay so ah but in the in the sewing we take it said
the nk beast it right now i'm okay boots ooh and ah
i really like a blanche hartman's
her rendition of that are translation of them vs i plunge into
yeah i dive into you know and in the diving the debts
i think no ordinary sense of live like diving into something has some aspect of risk
but
what blanche was proposing was forget about the risk just dive into it and that's actually what your needle does it dives into the fabric and comes backup
that's part one of your question
part two is
impermanence is the law
but it's not the entirety of the teachings
in other words
you can ask you can depend upon the buddha
you can depend upon the dorm and by extension you can compare depend upon the saga
there are aspects that might be impermanent but there's in terms of of buddha-nature buddha nature is in a sense
permanent
maybe if you want you think about it you can think of ah
you can think that it's impermanence is permanent
ah
but you know as we've been as lorena have been reading ha
we've been reading the yoga chara teachings ah will bring a lack of ventura sutra and some of these mahayana sutras ah get to a place where they say
this is permanent
this you can rely on
so this is a challenge ah and i think we have to think for ourselves our in our ordinary
in our ordinary mundane existence
permanent is not just a good idea it's the war
in the supra mundane
to the realm of buddha's
ah
there are things that you can count on
except that they're not drinks
maybe you can't grasp them like i'm thinking if one manifestation from of buddha is is a teacher prayed and any given teacher might go away any given dharma gate might no longer be present any given particular sanga may
dissolve for go away but maybe there's something in these tools that
there's another place they will arise in different circumstances again right so we're we're caught in this conundrum
ah
often we see ourselves
in the circumstance of the monday
that's the that's the that's the the frame in which we can understand our lives and our life in samsara is monday
ah the aspiration that were encouraged to
hold is a transcended one
he's one that that
leans towards the unconditioned where that moves towards the unconditioned ah any unconditioned is not impermanent but it same time it's not a thing either
so this is yeah this is difficult
other questions for gone

so i wanted to talk about
we've talked about the internal
refugees
and i'm very taken with
teaching that i gathered from
ah dr ambedkar in india
and i've spoken of this before
ha
what
what he often spoke of was
the but he said with the buddha's teaching of liberty equality and fraternity
it as i was thinking about that
i realized and i spoke to other friends in india that those map on onto
buddha dharma sangha very effectively that
liberty
is
liberation it's freedom hits enlightenment
and that equality
is
you can see that as the dharma
equality when you transform
you're deluded consciousness what you arrive at first his arm
the tool mirror of equality the mirror that reflects everything equally
so that's one of the aspects of of dorm is get everything nothing is without value
nothing is unworthy of our respect nothing nothing is one thing no one is a lot harder
and that brings us to
fraternity as sanga
that this is where
this is where these things play out
liberation
enlightenment
the dharma
the law of the universe the law of equality
those become apparent in our own communities and our tsongas
and this is very much
what com
suzuki roshi speaks of
i found a lecture
ha

various schools of buddhism have different views of dharma
dharma includes the other two buddha and xanga
in the zen school the emphasis is on sanga
because we emphasize
the practice of attaining enlightenment as the buddha did we naturally put emphasis on sanga
so zen emphasizes transmission from buddha and us and we emphasize sanga
for those who are
students are disciples of the buddha so the saga is we're
buddha and dharma play out

suzuka she says
it's necessary to be concentrated on one thing if we have three objects of worship it's difficult to be concentrated therefore we emphasize buddha as the sanga and this is something that not have also said he saw unforeseen that the future buddha
a will be the saga

so the sanga again is where this all plays out

if the boot is an abstraction either external to us or within us if the dharma is just
it's also an abstraction is something that we read in books then
not alive
and the sanga will not sustain us
but this is what we've been working not and i've been
i've been thinking about this
we think about this a lot lately ah i'm thinking about it in terms of sojourn roshi ah
you know what i i may have said to sit the day when it first came here
surgeon was in japan
and so my encounter for the first month or two was with the saga
and
everything went along smoothly schedule was maintained or sitting through maintain the temple was been cleaned and so forth ha and it all seemed
really smooth and natural
and i didn't miss
the mid may ask myself how to get to be this way
but i didn't know
because
sojourn wasn't there
and then when he returned i think in in december
hum
all the sudden i had the awareness said oh here's the missing piece of the puzzle
you know this is i don't understand quite how this works or how this evolved but i see that
this is the
buddha and dharma principle that was pivotal
that was
mysteriously activating
sanga
and i've been interested in this every ever ever since
because it is mysterious ah it's not that and you when you read the early sutras it's very much the same the buddha didn't do a lot of stuff ah he probably and bet he went to fewer meetings than i do ah
and he certainly didn't do email
or zoom conferences ah he just walked from place to place and saga configured in itself around his principles
and this is what i saw had pc see what i first came
hell it was really
really intriguing to me how does this happen
as
it's been this way that was
almost forty years ago
and it still is this way
ah
now he's not here anymore
and so what we're seeing i think
you know it it's it's not about me what we're seeing is actually the enactment of
t saga as the next buddha and i think it was very much same when i i never met suzuki roshi
and i don't know if there's anyone unload on online here today who did but
you never got the sense that again that he was out there know putting all the pieces together moving at all so that law worked there is something about his
centered buddha presence
that enabled
the dharma and sangha to flourish
without a lot of extra activity
and he was a refuge and one thing said that i think that
i see
from talking to his disciples
is that he had this mysterious quality of
by which everyone felt seen
in his presence
and i think that the buddha had that quality
and perhaps christ and others had that quality in a sense
sajjan had that quality ah
i wouldn't say that everybody felt seen but ah
most everyone felt accepted by him
and that acceptance is liberties
that's deliberate that's deliberative activity of a buddha
and it's not intentional it's not like a
you know it's not like a policy or something that year that you're ah putting forward could you think it's a good plan is just the way they moved in the world
and
it's offered to some degree
circumstantial i'm not sure that suzuki roshi manifested that way in japan
but once he got here he did
and if you put someone in another setting if you put sojourn in another setting maybe he would met a manifest the same way
so it's it's this great coming together of causes and conditions
and that allows
the three refugees that allows buddha dharma and sangha to flourish
it's remarkable quality i like to think that
we can each of us can cultivate that call you can look for that quality in ourselves
that it's not a
somehow
something that you have to be born with
but you have to have that capacity you have to be able you have to want to reach into it
ha and you have to take you for suzuki roshi
i think that he just had this he had some interesting vision that he was supposed to come here that this is where his life was going to flourish
and it's true
ah
where is that place for you
where's that place in each of our lives that were we can be lit where we can
feel liberated
and manifest the dharma and bring a unity among us
bring that forth
and that's to me that's the manifestation of the three refuges
so again i'm going to stop and leave time for some questions
ross
thank you that coincidentally i was having a conversation with a dormer friend anna today about a being seen or not seen and the distinction between a then practice and therapy practice so
so when you when you brought up a that virgin as buddha with a theme people although some people didn't feel
how do you discern the difference between am with
ah thing me
and not feeling fear
where did where does that a lie in the world of the relationship between teacher and student but that's really interesting question
thank you yeah thank you i think that
it may be something that has roots in our family of origin
that ah
in that family sometimes one feels seen one doesn't feel seen and that that's maybe a have to put that might be an accurate perception
you know because often children come into the world in a situation in which they are
with them and might see them as instrumental or might see them as ah supposing the fill fulfills something of the parental generations needs so they miss who that who that child is
and i think that
quite a number of us have had that experience i think that i guess the problem is that we internalize it
and then we you know so we carry that inside ourselves
to the extent that we believe it we believe we're not been seen we feel not seen when that may not actually be the situation with another with a teacher or with another person
ah
you know
ah
i feel like it's for me i'll just admit admitted something that i've had to work within myself ah and
realize that this is just an idea i have about myself
irrespective of what your teacher sees
the refuge is yours one has to find refuge in oneself and that in that way that's where that's what this teaching is pointing you to doesn't make sense yeah so the refuge has to come from within for oneself
and the teacher em
it in our relationship with there a teacher is ah
the prompts a doubt or question or suspicion or activate something from our our family of origin stuff than we have this question about well
how do i find refuge when this person that i've kind of give myself over to as my spiritual advisor it
battle i don't feel feel that is that it is at a replay of my of my father or is that does them up or in my actually being shown something that i don't want to see right well i think that key words to me in what you just said was a kid
yourself over
when i think it's important for us not to give ourselves away
i think it's like i will say
sojourn had hard things to say to me
and what i learned in time was too
step back
not reject them
but step back and really asked myself
assume there's something true in here
and what is it and to look for that rather than two
get tangled up in in the internal dynamics about whether i feel seen or not but say what can i learn here that's turning to me that turning the process inward gadget one more question a young we brought up a blanche and either her translation of plunging
into which i can have it in for giving over to you don't get being completely immersed in and so how do you view that
process of letting go in and plunging into the relationship with a teacher when in fact they mirror back something to you or offer something to you that makes you maybe not want to plunge so deep with them well i think keep to me i think it's important to take the long view ah
you know ah to take the really is a long smell that doesn't win a blended very right we were really lucky we we had a long life with our teacher
and it was a ended had aspects of ordinariness you know ups and downs but we had a long life in which ah as is my experiences
he was
pretty reliably himself
and then you have to prevent this giving over each of us has to figure

if there's some place where
our teacher if the in for teachers were our teachers ahead of us that's a good place to follow and to recognize that there are places where our teacher is not pair of us and don't go there because you think it's somehow what you're supposed to do
and this is where each of us has to rely but we have to be a lamp unto ourselves right yeah thank you very much thank you thank a really good questions kelsey
did he has on think you and this is kind of piggy backing off of what ross said and i had to get in his bathroom in the middle sunlight irritating on things but
i'm wondering if
if i don't feel seen by the saga or by you is that my problem for is that the tsongas problem or isn't even a problem
well i would say if you don't feel seen by me please talk to me
henry we should check it out
you know as the sanga like the song as a whole
what is the song as a bowl i don't know i mean that's the thing i don't i don't know ah
is it the saga as a whole or is it like a vibe that you get from a person that you project on the song is whole ahmed i'm not presupposing anything ah but ah it's very hard
i think if we try to characterize a whole community then probably it's gonna get pretty mushy
you know the important thing i think is too
be as specific as you can
you know if you something if there's a particular interaction that feels off between you and someone
ah
kick it out
but i think that
we have this
we often have this cloud-like feeling of being unworthy or misunderstood and ah
i don't think i don't think it's helpful i understand it i'm in understand how people go there but com that is not taking refuge
how can you take refuge

are you asking hi take refuge in that
like not been seen or have a feeling not seen how do you take refuge in saga
hey
or what is obstructing you from taking refuge in stock
you have to answer that here yeah i'm of my brain isn't ready to answer that with my heart isn't ready and thank you thank you
other thoughts or questions

alan yes my ask a question or i just wanted to actually recount i like this you know not exactly a question which i know is not not so cool to do but on the day i can the i was thinking i was remembering that one time you told me after
a surgeon gave me some painful feedback and i was stewing about it he said you know he's not saying this is what you boiled down to and that was extremely helpful and i think we this when we're talking about seeing and i've seen there's a little bit of idealizing lie
like honestly sometimes the i felt like he saw me and sometimes he didn't and that on looking back that seems like will ya of course i mean i think you do want to feel like your teacher appreciates you in your such this or your essence or something i mean you wouldn't i don't think you'd wanna stick with a teacher who
bad about yourself all the time or something like i mean there there's a limit but
i do think that
it's taking refuge in
something bigger than what can be seen somehow but is somehow also part of us now i lost a little bit there yeah but i think the day he's not saying what this is when you boil down to was really helpful right and yeah that's true
ah but the other thing that sojourn said which i
have always found as
really guiding advice someone asked him once during lecture what's the most important thing for a teacher to remember
and he said never want anything for yourself from your students
and that's really that's on the mark you know i don't feel
that
what that's what he was looking for and you know i've been reading a book by a friend of mine which which i like a lot have by my friend general maranello and in seattle
ah
and by chance or by korma he had a serious relationships with teachers who were abusers
and this is no secrets it's all in the book and he had a he had a background of
of family background that included abuse
and you know these teachers whom i won't name
wanted something for themselves
mostly wanted sex
ah
and
it's not just what you
that that you don't boil down to what the criticisms are a view but also to recognized ah that this person the teacher does not want something for themselves from you
ah in other words they want the what they want is for you to wake up
and i always felt that
ah from surgeon and he was very generous in allowing me to
basically to explore refuge with other teachers
which is a risky thing to do
so let me a time is not along the me ah
can we call on judy
nanjiani
think kilos on hi everybody
ah
i was wondering
why a one point or
kerry introduce the on
the framing or of faith as a verb is facing and i was just pondering at in the context of this conversation around teacher student relationship i'm in dogan calls it entanglement
tangled vines
is so it's about including all of that complexity and not being able to ever pin it down
and i was wondering about that in terms of what you were saying about faith if we spin it as a verb of thing are being entangled if that helps at all with the seeming conundrum of mutual accountability
america to they're saying
i think i said that phases and activity
and i would say similar everything the whole essence of our practice is actually about activity
you know we'll look at the end of the ginger conan dog it is telling the story about the master fanning himself you know and you know he tells his student her
you don't understand the nature of fanning you may think you understand the nature of wind but you don't understood in nature of fanning so it's activity
in alignment
with the dharma to phases activity that arises within our practice enlightenment is not a state of mind enlightenment is an activity that to me everything that
the values that we cherish
our only revealed by their activity
and then include faith
so you have to if you're invested in that than it seems to me that's where the song goes refuge comes in
the activity of song alive that reveals these relationships right an outward suzuki roshi says in one of these commenters he says that buddha and dharma or manifest given the activity of saga
thank you jody
i'm one of the first lectures i heard you give you talked about ah practice there are two two things to use and practices together action i think it and you said something i really liked this image of us all being dirty potatoes in a pot and beings
stirred and i'm there's like a kind of a roughness to that image
to the potato image for the potato image
and ah when is did too rough
when is it too rough ah
and who's to say
what the potato might have something to say within play better and i don't know ah
ha it's too rough when who knows you know if it gets too rough then make mashed potatoes
i don't go i'd want to extend that at for do for our therapists i think the other metaphor that we use his of
stones in a tumblr
polishing each other by tumbling over each other and i would say it's too rough when
they get smashed
when people get chewed up
are the object of our practice is not to grind people down
so together action together action is a ah
a translation it's one way to express what dogan talked about as the fourth
embracing dharma
in ah poly it's samana data or which you could translate as together action you can translate his cooperation cooperation you could translated as ah in in
that is text before racing dramas as ah
when blocking it right now ha
identity action identity action thank you
but that that subscribe to some people ah it means action in identity with but samana data the the root of it
he is i think the root of our word seen is recognizing sameness so we go back to
dharma as equality
we go back to you know to every potato in that pot
is of equal value
is equally tasty
when we prepare it ah and which just trying to get that the mud off a it
so
but we're not trying to smash the potatoes were not trying to crack the rocks
and we're not trying to breakdown people into their component parts ha we want to we want as we rub up against each other in saga so that we can actually shine forth
since
what we're getting near the end deserve one more question or comment that anyone wants to make

yeah preston
was on could you say something about the relationship between taking refuge and
ah submission her resignation or surrendering
because the three different words
surrendering
can be very positive surrendering your ego
surrendering your self centredness
ha giving up you know the the word islam i believe means surrender
you know it's giving up your small self
two
something larger than yourself
so that has a kind of positive valence or can have a positive feelings if it's surrender or submission ah over the third were used
i'm resignation resignation you know if it's surrender submission in the in the sense of
yielding to someone
who is more powerful than you
thereby yielding to their power ah that's really that's troubling and resignation
in many ways to me it means giving up on yourself
and it's also not a positive value so i think the critical question that we all have to explore in our practice is
what is the distinction between
resignation and acceptance
that's a live question
tides that's a good one to explore
no am i
just giving up on this or am i actually accepting what's happening because that's the course to go at the moment
the concussion him one more question from susan and then
she's still here yeah i'm here
it sounds like you know what's really important than his arm and what sojourn always encourages you have to stand on your own two feet that's right so like when past and said submissions are a lot of thought like oh yeah that you're currently thing there is it so
hey to surrender as long as you're standing on your own two feet and am
if there's hesitation there
then that can be
i'm dangerous or the wrong direction i remember when i first came to practice and i said to him i'm not really sure if i belong here i'm not really sure where i belong and he said
yes you know where you belong in the i'm innocent i think you know exactly where you belong stop hesitating
and that was very encouraging and i think like something about what you've been talking about on like at relationship between teacher and still it's very important to stand on one's own two feet right and then to have that relationship with the teacher yes yes that i ticket exactly
right on
and it's also ok
to question yourself
yeah so this is the first period
ah
of glass means system is not knowing not knowing means questioning yourself but it doesn't mean doubting yourself and it doesn't mean i'm elected that's different from i mean i'm kind of an expert on hesitation so i think that's different from hesitation it's very different
and hesitation is just mean it but
even if you hesitate
you still have to stand on your own two feet you should you need to know where your feet are and this
see i pointed that suzuki roshi made over and over and sojourn made over and over you know extending from suzuki roshi but also from his own exploration and ah this is what we are all learning
that you know that instruction during the translation gave up of blanche sang plans or dive or to more life and jump off the hundred foot pole
that's all about finding the confidence not to hesitate right right and that's very encouraging yeah i think that that's that's our way you know and it means coming forward to each other
he means coming forward to our teacher and teacher coming forward to us it's a it's a there's a mutuality their ah of two people standing on your feet