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How We Grow in Practice
The talk presents communal Zen practice as a field for gradual transformation, not the elimination of difficulty: practice helps people recognize where they become fixed and meet those conditions as the path. Through the linked stories of Baoshe, it emphasizes moving from being “blown” by approval and disapproval to engaging conditions directly; bodhisattva vow sustains this work as sincere yearning to awaken and act compassionately without knowing in advance how.
Texts and works referenced
- “Genjō Kōan” — Dōgen: Cited for the Baoshe fanning story, which illustrates that the universal reach of wind is realized through actively engaging it.
- Brahmā’s Net Sutra — author unspecified: Identified as the source of the bodhisattva precepts and a teaching that yearning is the root of awakening and practice.
- Lojong slogans — authorship unspecified: The slogan “Whatever you meet is the path” reinforces the teaching to work with, rather than avoid, present conditions.
- Koan about Baoshe and the teachers Zhang Jing and Nanshuang — authorship unspecified: Contrasts the monk’s initial susceptibility to approval and disapproval with Baoshe’s later, intimate engagement with the wind.
- Story of Kan Feng’s “one straight road to nirvana” — authorship unspecified: Kan Feng draws a line in the air, indicating that the path to nirvana is precisely here.
- Aiken Roshi anecdote, quoted in Foster — Foster’s full name and work title unspecified: Aiken describes the mind as “a mess,” adding that it was worse before; the anecdote frames practice as change without perfection.
AI Suggested Title: Meeting Conditions as the Path
surpass, penetrating and perfect dharma is rarely met with, even in a hundred thousand million kalpas, having it to see and listen to, to remember and accept. I vow to taste the truth of the Tathagatha's words. Good morning. Good morning, honey. Can you hear me OK? Those of you online can hear me OK? Well, happy to see all of you here. My name is Dave Rutschman. a.k.a. Dave Rutschman-Beiler.
[01:13]
I sometimes use this long name. And I am a practitioner here at the Berkley Zen Center. And increasingly, these last weeks, I've been feeling how valuable it is, how important it is, how precious it is, what we're doing here, what we're doing together at the Berkley Zen Center and at places like the Berkley Zen Center. I think the opportunity that we have to practice this way, more and more I'm feeling how much it matters.
[02:25]
You know, how much it matters that we're doing this, that we get to do this together. This great shaking, this great task. is really vital. And I've been feeling that more and more. I have a quote from the great Blanche Hartman. Many of you knew Blanche. She was the first woman to be the abbess at the San Francisco Zen Center, an original student of Suzuki Roshi's, started practice actually here.
[03:28]
Not in this building, but at what was then called the Berkeley Zendo, I believe. So this is a quote from Blanche. I said, my life depends on all the lives around me. We all support each other. None of us could take care of ourselves in a world all alone. We're so completely interwoven and interdependent. Our life depends on one another. And as you begin to realize that, you can't help but be grateful. My life depends on all the lives around me. We all support each other. None of us could take care of ourselves in a world all alone. We're so completely interwoven and interdependent. Our life depends on one another. And as you begin to realize that, you can't help but be grateful.
[04:32]
So, I think maybe that's a little connecting to the gratitude for what we get to do together, and that we get to do it together. That's a piece of what I'm feeling. I think the other piece is the backdrop, is the sort of larger context of our time. I think there's a pretty palpable sense, you know, of these powerful currents of recklessness and of cruelty in the culture. You see it in the scapegoating and demonization of immigrants, the attacks on the rights and dignity of trans people. You see it in all these hundreds now of this sort of weaponized greed, hate, delusion.
[05:43]
And against that backdrop, the specialness of what it is that we're doing, for me at least, becomes more and more and more clear. What we're doing together, if you zoom out enough, is we're working to create a culture of wisdom and compassion. That's what we're up to. That's what we're doing together. So I wanted to say a little bit about how I think this works. There are a lot of ways to talk about how this works, but here's one way. I think that what we're doing today, right now, but what we're doing every day in this temple and in temples like this is or in communities like this of all kinds, some of them aren't temples, is we're creating a kind of space or a kind of field with our community and with our effort.
[06:59]
And it's a field within which each of us is able to grow and change in these particular ways. It's a space for a certain kind of maturation. And if we're lucky, it's a space for a certain kind of transformation. We have in our tradition this whole set of practices and teachings and doctrines and texts and ceremonies. and stories, a lot of really, really good stories, and images and aspirations. And all of that creates the conditions for a certain kind of change. And I wanted to think a little bit about that change, about what it is that happens in the field of our practice.
[08:12]
Maybe to start, I'll say what I don't think happens. I don't think all our problems go away. I don't think that we magically know how to get along with each other or always know what to do in any given circumstances. Probably none of you were under the impression that's what happened here, but if you were, I'm really sorry. You've been misled. That's not what happens. It's much softer and it's much more subtle. There's this great story that I came across recently in Foster. It's a story about Robert Aiken. Aiken Roshi was at a gathering of Buddhist teachers from different lineages. He was an elder at this point and so had been practicing for many, many decades, and someone in the audience asked him, this is such a great question, after all these years of practice, what's your mind like?
[09:28]
And Aiken Roshi said, oh, it's a mess. But you should have seen it before. It's really good, right? It's a mess, but you should have seen it before. There's something in that about the way we change or the way we grow in practice. The way exactly. But something happens. Something really does happen. And it's really valuable. All right. I'm thinking about this question of how we change, how we're transformed by a field of sincere practice at a temple like this one. And I want to start by telling an old story.
[10:35]
It's a little bit dense, but I think it's worth feeling our way into it if we go slowly. So bear with me. This is an old story in our tradition. A sincere monk goes to visit a teacher many centuries ago. The teacher is named Zhang Jing. And our monk, our main character here, enters circles the teacher's seat three times, shakes his staff, and stands. So I just want to say this is pretty good. In these old stories, what's happening is students and teachers, or sometimes students and students, or sometimes teachers and teachers, or sometimes who you think is going to be the teacher turns out to be the student, are talking about reality.
[11:40]
always talking about reality they're talking about how things truly are and our our monk here i think has some understanding is is demonstrating reality knows enough and you know i don't know how hard one this is it could take us a really long time to really get to to feel that we're a part of reality you know that we we belong So if we're going to talk about reality, I'm going to walk around your seat three times, and I'm going to stand here. I'm showing you reality. It's pretty good. It's pretty good. And John Jay thought it was pretty good too, the teacher, because he says, write, write. So our guy's kind of pleased. And a little later, He goes to another teacher, Nanshuang.
[12:41]
And this is maybe... Yeah, I don't know. Let's see what you guys think about this. He circles the teacher's seat three times. He stands there at attention. So, I don't know, you know? Do you get to go back to the same... to the same well? Is it... I don't know. Anyway, Nanshwan says, wrong. So, the first time, Zhang Jing is right, right. The second time, Nanshwan says, wrong, wrong. And the monk says, Zhang Jing said, right. You know, the other guy liked it. Like, how? Well, why do you say wrong? Goes, circles, right, right. Goes, circles, wrong, wrong.
[13:45]
The monk says, Zhang Jing said right, why do you say wrong? Nanshan said, Zhang Jing is right. It's you who is wrong. This is something that can be blown by the power of the wind. Finally it turns bad. This is something that can be blown by the power of the wind. Finally, it turns bad. So this is a complicated story and a lot here. Like all our old stories, it's really dense with meaning, really dense. But the threat that I want to tug at here is that the monk seems to be a little bit tripped up by one teacher saying right and the other teacher saying wrong. say wrong. The other guy said, right. That's sort of the feeling I have. There's a little stuckness there. Hong Xiu, the great Tian Tong, a really important teacher in our Livia, says about this story, write for the trap.
[14:58]
It's like there's a trap here with this one approved, this one disapproved. and our monk gets maybe a little stuck there you can say the trap is approval and disapproval there's something that doesn't just flow that the monk seems to think well if it was right for Zhang Zhang it should be right for Nanshuang because it was like this yesterday it should be like this today you're maybe resisting a little bit completely able to let go or to open up to you know the great ceaseless mystery the flow of now it's right now it's wrong can you continue to stay with it and in this story
[16:02]
It seems like he gets a little bit jammed up. Right and wrong, watch out for the trap. He's like, maybe the trap got him. And the way he's caught in the trap is that he's blown around by the wind. He's blown around by the wind. Let's see, what does Manchuan say? Manchuan says, Zhang Jing is right. It's you who is wrong. This is something that can be blown by the power of the wind. Finally, it turns bad. It's getting blown around. So I want to notice we haven't gotten yet to the part that's about transformation. We haven't gotten yet to the part that's about what can happen for us if we're lucky in a field of sincerity. What we have so far is we have a monk, we have a person who, I think to be fair, really has some ability to demonstrate the Dharma.
[17:08]
I'm really moved by that. Let's talk about reality. Here's reality. But also seem to get a little bit on wanting yesterday's move to work today, you know? So this is a story about a teacher maybe reflecting to a student where he's stuck. And my hope for all of us is that we get to see where we're stuck. We get to see the little places where we jam up. So the wind is the problem, right? The wind is blowing. The wind of right and wrong. the wind of approval and disapproval. And so here's the good part. I'm so excited about this part.
[18:09]
Some of you will know this right away. So, this monk who's being blown around by the wind is a Magu, or Mayu, which is a mountain, that's a place, and his name is Baushe. Mayu Baushe. And that matters a lot because we have this other beautiful story that's really familiar with us. About this monk later, later in his life. So when he's a student, he's getting blown around by the wind. Finally it turns bad. But then he stays in a field of practice for some amount of time. This story. Zen master Baoshe of Mount Mayu was fanning himself. A monk approached and said, Master, the nature of wind is permanent and there is no place it does not reach.
[19:15]
Why do you fan yourself? Although you understand that the nature of wind is permanent, Baoshe replied, you do not understand the meaning of its reaching everywhere. What is the meaning of its reaching everywhere? asked the monk. The master just kept fanning himself. It's a really famous story for us because Dogen references this story in Genjo Koan. Zen master Baoshe of Mount Mayu was fanning himself. A monk approached and said, Master, the nature of wind is permanent and there is no place it does not reach. Why then? Although you understand that the nature of wind is permanent, you do not understand the meaning of its reaching everywhere. What is the meaning of its reaching everywhere? Baoshe just fans himself. So, I think this is such a big deal. What is it about the nature of our practice that someone who is blown around by the wind
[20:25]
becomes someone who fans himself. Because you might think if your problem is wind, you've got to get out of the wind. You've got to get away from the wind. You need to go inside or something. Live somewhere that's not windy. Wind is the problem. But he fans himself, which means that you're intimate with wind. It means that you participate in wind. You engage. or you would wind something that's a problem becomes something that you are working with or are connected to in some way and for me at least that really that's what the invitation of our practice is I learned how to drive when I was a teenager in the Midwest.
[21:38]
We lived in Chicago. So I learned how to drive on ice, on snow and ice. And then I drove a lot. In my 20s, I drove one of those big recycling trucks. You know, the big dumpsters. I definitely had some challenges driving those big trucks on ice in the winter in Chicago. But some of you know, those of you that have driven on snow and ice, you know how to do it. You know what you're supposed to do when you start to slide, right? You turn into the skid. You turn into the skin. You don't fight against the difficulty or the problem or the... It makes things way worse. It's actually really dangerous.
[22:41]
You actually start to spin out and you damage other people when you're fighting against what's happening. But if you can go with it, actually, it's safer. It's wiser. It's more skillful. So I thought maybe we could say that our practice is to always turn into the skin. You know? And we're always skinning. Yeah. Whatever it is that's happening in our life, whatever the conditions are, that's precisely the ground for liberation. In the kind of Tibetan layer of our tradition, the Indo-Tibetan layer, you're familiar with these Lojong slogans, these little pithy mottos that you kind of carry around with you or you meditate on.
[23:48]
And there's one Lojong slogan that says, whatever you meet is the path. Whatever you meet is the path. It sounds a lot like turn into the skid. It sounds a lot like if your problem is wind, get a fan. Work with it in some way. Get close to it in some way. So I want to suggest that this is the great gift. that can happen in our lives in a field of practice like this one is that we can see if we're lucky and with the help of the people around us is the path. Maybe one more story.
[24:50]
So whatever you mean as the path is really wonderful, and that's in the kind of Indo-Tibetan style. And usually in our tradition, really is we tell stories, we do it in stories. So there's another story. A monk asks the priest, Kan Feng, the Bhagavats of the Ten Directions. Bhagavats is an epithet of... Honored one or blessed one, so the Buddha, the highest beings. The Bhagavats of the ten directions have one straight road to nirvana. I wonder where that road is. Kan Feng lifted up his staff, drew a line in the air, and said, here. All the Buddhas have one straight road to nirvana. I wonder where it is. Here it is. The road is right here, of course.
[25:51]
Always. Where else could it be? Whatever we need is the path. I think I want to say just maybe one more thing if that's okay. And then I want to hear I hear from some of you. So there is a particular kind of field that we make together that makes this kind of change possible. And we make it with our sincerity. We make it with our effort. And really one of the ways we make it, one of the central ingredients of it is our vow. We make it with our vow. I've been thinking lately that there's a really important distinction between a promise and I think a promise is when I say I'm going to do something and I know how to do it and I know I can do it.
[27:10]
So if I promise you something, I understand it and I have a plan. If I promise to pick you up at the airport, I should know when your flight's getting in, and I should know where the airport is, and I should have a car, and I should know how to drive, and I should have that day off work. Right? All those things need to be true if I promise to pick you up at the airport. It would actually be really rude to say I'm going to pick you up at the airport and actually not know what an airport is and not know where it is and never have seen an airplane drive and not have a car. That's a friendship wrecker. Don't do that. But in the realm of vow, that's exactly how a vow works.
[28:15]
It's just naked, raw, wanting. I want to pick you up at the airport. I don't know what an airport is. I don't know how I'm going to get there. I don't know when you get there. But I want to. That's a vow. So we shouldn't mix them up because it's really bad manners to vow to pick someone up at the airport. It doesn't work. But they're different realms actually. Necessarily a vow is that I don't know how to do it. I want to do it and I don't know how. So that's how we make the field of wisdom and compassion. I really want to do it. I really want to do it and I don't know how. That's a vow. Vows come from sincere aspiration. Vows come from our yearning that we want to and we don't know how.
[29:23]
And so we want to become the kinds of beings that might know how. And that's how we make this field. That's how we make this field. There's a really important text in our tradition called the Brahma's Net Sutra. And it's been on my mind, actually, because there's a group of folks here that is beginning to sow their rakasus in preparation for lay ordination, where you will receive bodhisattva precepts. And this is the text that our bodhisattva precepts come from, the Brahmasana Sutra. It's this Chinese text that has this kind of complicated history, how it got to Japan and why it's all. But our 16 precepts come from this text, and there's this section in this text about yearning. So this is what the Buddha says. My disciples, you should vow and vow with great yearning, with total yearning.
[30:29]
Because of this yearning mind, one is released from countless bonds of views. Because of this yearning mind, innumerable marvelous practices are brought to completion. The innumerable merits of bodhi, of awakening, take yearning as their root. Yearning is the root of awakening. Did you know this? I didn't know this until I read this in the Dharma's concert. One first arouses a yearning mind, and in the middle one cultivates the way. As your practices complete your vow, you will directly attain Buddhahood. Giving rise to various views is not liberating wisdom. This is the essence of the vow, the origin of all practices. My disciples, you should vow and vow with great yearning, with total yearning. The innumerable merits of Bodhi take yearning as their root.
[31:33]
So yearning is I want to and I don't know how. I want to wake up with all beings and I don't know how. I want to transform a culture of cruelty into a culture of compassion and I don't know how. That's yearning. And because I want to and I don't know how, there's a kind of patience and a kind of humility And because it's a shared undertaking, in that field of vow, we create the conditions that make it possible more and more for us to turn towards the world as it really is and ourselves as we really are. And it makes it possible for us to wake up, to wake up together.
[32:36]
So that's what we're doing. And that's what we're doing today. And that's what we're doing every day that we're here. And that's really great. I think I'm going to stop. And I'm going to... Ask if there are thoughts or questions or reflections, either in the room. Yeah, Marley. Thank you for this talk and for tying those two stories, which I knew independently but had not made the connecting the dots.
[33:50]
Yeah. It's the same person. The dots. Something that struck me about seeing those together is they're also two stories, even the later story is, doing the same physical gesture twice, but somehow he's figured out how to have the right, I don't know, . But, wow. So I guess, you know what? I got a million questions, but I'll leave it to the next person. Thank you, Marlee. But I guess I really appreciate... I think what you're pointing to, in a way, is the change... Baoshe is still Baoshe.
[34:56]
I don't know, maybe Baoshe is a dancer. Baoshe likes doing stuff with his body, like showing stuff physically. That's still true, right? Aiken Roshi's mind is still a mess. We get to be exactly how we are, and there's some intimacy with our life, with what the problem was that is possible. So, yeah, I appreciate you. I hadn't made that connection, the physicality in both stories. Yeah. Yeah, thanks. Thank you for your talk this morning. I appreciate it that you sort of alluded to this sort of magical transformation and this idea of change and people changing. And I'm curious, for me, there's a tension now where I kind of look around and I go, oh, I don't like any of this.
[36:01]
I want to change it. And then also times where I can't really change any of this, what can I change here? And kind of both are like, I don't know, I think both are important, because if I was only, I can't do anything here, I'll only be here, I feel like I'd miss, I feel like there's something missed at the same time. I think I'm also missing something if I'm only concerned with the external, but what can I change? So I'm just curious about that tension. of change, change external, balancing us. Yeah, I really appreciate that. And I think the wisdom of our practice would be kind of sort of like none of my business. They create each other. So like our job is to practice compassion and
[37:05]
Is that inside or outside? I don't know. I guess start somewhere if you want. You start outside and then it flows back to inside, or you start inside and it flows to outside. Inside and outside are creating each other. The world arise together. So are you working on yourself? Are you working on the world? Yes. Because again, you get to be part of the world. You're part of the world. I think sometimes we can think it's a little bit, we have to decide what we're going to do, and I guess, yeah, kind of where to emphasize or where you start, that's fair, and that's maybe conditions or temperament or, I don't know, but any change we make to the outside changes us, and any change to us changes the outside, you know, it's all together. Does that make sense? I just want to see if there's anyone online. You can raise a hand. Okay, then there's more.
[38:08]
Maybe here? Yeah, Patrick. What's that? Just do what you're doing. Okay, I'm doing what I'm doing here. I was kind of hoping the mic wouldn't run out before it got to me. Because I know I'm going to get this wrong. It's pretty still though. It's pretty still in this room. You can feel it. It's unusually still. The flames on the candle are going straight up, as far as I can see. And I can see a little bit from the outside. Of the outside, I don't see the branches of trees moving much. So where's the wind reaching right now?
[39:16]
If we're lucky enough to enter spaces together with no wind, we can just put our fan down. You know? Is that what you're doing now? Yes. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Patrick. Let's see the back. Thanks so much for your talk and for the conversation. What's in my heart at the moment that relates to all of this is there's a lot of conversation about what it means to be in solidarity right now, and the languaging shifting from being an ally to being in solidarity. And one of the definitions I heard of that is that your life isn't much at stake.
[40:25]
as the one you're in solidarity with, that that is the enactment of waking up together. And so what connects in that conversation hearing is what it means to show up. So, for instance, the relationship of righteous anger to fierce compassion, to go to a protest and the messaging or the energy is let's say, filled with rage, outrage, and there's messaging that can come across as othering. So how does what you're speaking to today support us showing up in that wind and enacting our vow that leaves no one out? Judy, I appreciate that.
[41:31]
I mean, I think we moved to come across this passage in the Brahmas Nat Sutra about yearning. And so I think wanting without knowing how is a really powerful place to be. So we want compassion. We don't want to fall into hatred and anger. And maybe we don't know how exactly. So, you know, you go and you show up and you do your best. So for me, there's something really moving about staying with the wanting and not necessarily having a . Because that, again, is, you know, that's the world of picking people up at airports, which is awesome. But we're up to something a little bit different. Thank you. Thank you. I think Jerry had her hand up. Thanks a lot for the talk.
[42:50]
What I wanted to talk about was the repetition of the same action. you basically can't repeat the same action, first of all. But in my work as a pediatrician, when a kid gets approval for something, they just shine and they want to do it and they just want to do it all the time. And they do it in any kind of circumstance just to get the approval. So there's something about that we all have that child needing approval from our teacher. And so, of course, you're going to try, it works. So that's just kind of a, that would be the kind way of looking at it. The other way is, you know, people have egos and they're really practicing and they get attached to the ego thing of being approved.
[43:56]
When they reject the next time, they're not doing it out of spontaneity or appropriateness of what's going on right now. It's not skillful means anymore. It's an action with a self-interest behind it. And we try to be present in each moment and give what's coming up sincerely in the context of that moment. And you can't learn how to do that by practicing. Yeah, I really appreciate that. Thanks for unpacking that, that part of the koan. And again, with... Baushe was really lucky to have where he's stuck. So he could go off and study it for who knows how long, you know, and then figure out how to faint, you know.
[45:03]
So thanks to all of you. Please show me where I'm stuck, you know. Thank you so much. And then I'll know, I'll know, yeah, I'll kind of know the next thing to work with. really want it to be right. It's like, I'll work with that. It's all workable. I think you said the kindness. That's the kind out. It's all workable. Of course we're stuck. But it's workable. It's workable. Jeremiah? A lot of gratitude for your talk and the Berkley Zen Center. You know, this might feel like it resonates with you, but you know, it's my feeling that maybe rare is the person who
[46:16]
on a really solid winning streak. You know? Yeah. It's fair. And to arrive and be surrounded or yearning for how to accept what is unfolding in front of them as their life and the way is a wonderful and so I have a lot of gratitude what is most difficult and make that the way or have an understanding that that actually is the way you know instead of turning towards everything else that might you know help you numb how you feel as it unfolds in front of you so
[47:45]
I thank you for helping clarify yearning. And I think that the distinction between a promise and a vow was beautiful. And I vow to try and understand it. Me too. Yeah, Tom. Thank you for your work, for the images of driving in snow and ice. I grew up in St. Louis. I had more than one time skiing out, getting trees.
[48:48]
just reflecting on now is when someone got stuck in the snow speaking of getting stuck they just hit the accelerator the tires just spin and then all over the world people stop and jump out of their car and push you out and that felt so good to be able to do that for somebody and my relatives in minnesota they shovel each other's driveways there's a shared purpose and shared helping that um we don't have so much here It's too easy. That's the problem. Yeah, well good. Maybe then things can get harder for us and we can be kinder to each other. That's a great image. I really love that. And it's really true. Yeah, people get you out and you got to work your way out. Like back and forth thing you got to do. Yeah, that's really good. Someone else give a talk about that because that's really good. I don't know what it means yet, but that's great. Tom, Tom, you give a talk on that.
[49:50]
I think we have time maybe for one more comment or question, or stop now and go have tea. Yeah, chill. Thanks, Dave. In regards to this quote, sometimes that support feels abstract. Like, of course it's there. Of course I don't exist without everyone else. So what's disappointment? Yeah, disappointment is maybe wanting the support to look different, right? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Thank you for supporting me in this way.
[50:54]
I actually support me in another way. You know? That's fair. That's fair. That happens a lot. And so, again, you know, the yearning, yearning what we want and I don't know how is you know may I may I feel all of your support it is may I support you in the way I most want to and I don't know how you know and so in the meantime we're going to mess up and we're going to kind of bug each other yeah that's um that's a helpful perspective thanks thank you on Zoom.
[54:26]
My name is Sho Ray. This afternoon, we'll be sharing items from Hozan Roshi's collection. Please feel community room during our informal tea to choose an item. This coming Monday, Nathan Britton will give away Seeking Mind talk at 8 a.m. in the online Zendo. Next Saturday's Dharma talk will be given by Gary Artem. Sunday, March 30th, there will be a women's 8 a.m. to 12.15 p.m. Details are on our website. The Wednesday drop-in group meets from 7.10 to 9 p.m. The group particularly welcomes newcomers to Zen practice. For more information, contact Ikushin Jerry Oliva. And her email is in the links for reoccurring activities on the website. BCC has a queer Dharma group that meets in the community room on the second and fourth Mondays of the month from 7 to 8, 15 p.m.
[55:30]
This group welcomes those who identify as LGBTQ as well as those who may be questioning an relationship to any of these aspects of identity. You can speak with me or Pauline Kirshen for more information. And for more information about our programs or about membership here, you can check the bulletin board out in the courtyard. You can also check the Zoom chat. To make a donation to support BCC, we have a donation box set up in the courtyard at the table just under the bulletin board. You can also visit the website and click the generosity tab. Lastly, I will need two people who have time to stay after who can help wash teacups. One more. Thanks, Gary. And those in the Zendo, please maintain silence as you exit until you are off our porch, and then feel free to socialize. And those online, feel free to unmute and share a greeting.
[56:34]
Thank you. Good morning, everyone. Good morning. Have a great day. Really good talk.
[56:53]
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